That Spot in the Middle - Pastor Ricky Jenkins & Dr. Bryan Loritts | Masterclass Episode 2

00:01 - Speaker 1 So you ask the question how do you train up and lead the next generation? 00:05 - Speaker 2 I think it's important that you let that generation have a voice, this idea that every Sunday we can guarantee that God's going to meet us in the 45-minute presentation. Ladies and gentlemen, it is just not how it works. In the sacred narrative, how does he give you a heart for such a specific place and then to really see the stats and to really say we want to? 00:23 - Speaker 3 make change and it's possible. You know, the hardest part in leading change is not where you leave and it's not when you get there. It's that spot in the middle. 00:30 - Speaker 4 So sometimes in your weakness, foolishness, not getting it, God's like he just does it anyway. 00:36 - Speaker 2 If there's a core issue in my faith, then I can't see God right and I'll demand he does for me quickly what my character can only handle slowly. How do you know what you're speaking into until you hear where they're coming from? 00:48 - Speaker 1 I had to see that proper rest and replenishment wasn't in the way. 00:53 - Speaker 3 It was the way. 00:54 - Speaker 2 I will borrow from what's on the inside of you and bring it out, so the quality goes in before the song comes out. Humility is this acceptance of who you really are, who God really is, that puts you in a posture to encounter God in a genuine and authentic way. Welcome to Voices from the Masterclass, a special Faithly podcast series brought to you by Faithly preaching masterclass and leading leaders, collective. 01:21 - Speaker 3 Pastor Adam Durso here for Faithly Stories. I'm the founder and president of Leading Leaders Collective and a senior advisor at Faithly, and I get the opportunity to sit with the angel that is over this house here being hosted preaching masterclass at Southwest Church. Pastor Ricky, introduce yourself to the audience, my brother. 01:38 - Speaker 1 Thanks, bro. Thanks for having me. Ricky Jenkins, and glad to serve here at Southwest Church, indian Wells, california, for eight years, man, and we're so glad to have Preaching Masterclass with us. 01:47 - Speaker 3 Preaching Masterclass has been fire. We'll talk about that in a second, because, pastor Bryan Loritts, you tore the house down last night. Man, you absolutely just crushed. Please introduce yourself to the audience. 01:58 - Speaker 5 Yeah, Bryan Loritts Serve as a teaching pastor at the Summit Church and do some other things written some things, so it's great to be here. 02:08 - Speaker 3 You said something last night. Let's start there that the Chuck Swindoll quote that maybe the most dangerous thing about this is we can learn how to do it. Talk to the ministers, the leaders that are out there listening. I mean, you challenged this audience last night. Is this a gig or is this a calling? Speak to that. 02:29 - Speaker 5 Yeah. So I want to be careful. There's a place for competency, right. I'm a big believer in education. I've gotten degrees. I got a kid who feels called to ministry. I'm like get the education, learn this stuff. We just sat in a session with Pastor Ricky learning about systems. 02:52 So I am not anti-competence and you know, even as I read in the book of Exodus and the building of the tabernacle, it's God saying I want so-and-so to do this because they are skilled right. So I want to be. I just can't be louder that there is a place for competency. I guess what I was trying to come against is a spirit of professionalism that puts everything in a competency box and doesn't leave any room for the anointing, the unction of the Holy Spirit and, more importantly, a life that is built on John, chapter 15, where I'm abiding in the vine. So I should be ministering, and this isn't just for pastors and worship leaders, I think it's for people in the marketplace, business sector. Anyone who names the name of Jesus Christ should be ministering out of the context of an abiding relationship with Christ. 03:38 - Speaker 3 I think you kind of then piggybacked on that a little bit this morning. I think we were saying this before Pastor Ryan, you walked back in the room the idea that David, when they're looking for somebody to play for Saul, David's skillful and the Lord is with them, that somehow they're not in competition. We don't need sloppiness being blamed on the Holy Spirit, Absolutely yeah. 03:59 - Speaker 1 I think you know I was trying to express my own experience with it. I think we work in a very relational arena with respect to our craft. We are preachers who weave together text and exegesis with art and history and other genres of thought, and we create this artistic moment every Sunday, moment every Sunday. We are relational by design. We are shepherding, the sheep of the fold, and I think most leaders listening are really good organically, but the default is not that good organizationally, and I think if we learn how to conflate those two together and call that leadership, I think the game changes. And, to your point, that's what we see in scripture. 04:44 Moses was organically connected to God, organically connected to the people, but had a system. After Jethro talked with them and said hey, no, you need leaders of tens and hundreds and thousands and all these good things. And here's the thing that leaders need to be reminded of God is a hundred percent in both. He's not boxed in one, and I think at the same time, that means some leaders can overdo it one way or the other. Yes, there are no guys out there that are organized to a fault, but ain't no Holy Ghost in there, nowhere. You know, it's just system, system, system. I think you have to really present both and call that leadership. Hence our conversation this morning really present both and call that leadership. 05:27 - Speaker 3 Hence our conversation this morning. So I come from a Pentecostal upbringing in New York City and I think we tend to think no if it's too organized, if we're planning out the year, what if the Holy Spirit decides he wants to say something this week and you're challenging people to be like no, no, no, you need to be thinking about what God is saying to the house. I mean the weight of that's important. I mean Jesus is talking to his church in Revelation, seven different locations, and he doesn't speak to the congregation directly, he speaks through the angel. There's a weightiness on the importance of your role in communicating what God is saying. Thus saith the Lord to the house. How important is that for those that are listening right now? 06:15 - Speaker 1 I think it's a dance. 06:17 I think Bryan articulated this real well when you were talking about jazz right Like I'm studied, I'm familiar, I've written out my best sense of what the Holy Spirit has inspired this text to mean. But I'm comfortable enough with it where I can be sensitive to that opportune moment where the Holy Spirit says boom, or reveals you something in the room that says draw that out, or man. I know, Bryan, you've probably had a thousand Sundays I know I have as well where something just pops into the mind yeah, even in the preacher moment. That was not there before. But I can get back to where I'm supposed to be Doc, why don't you flesh that out? 06:58 - Speaker 5 Because I think that's really what we're talking about. Well, yeah, let me reach back and grab something. So look, I grew up charismatic very much. 07:18 I think part of the one of the critiques I would make on my own tribe charismatic tribe is we tend to put everything, all of our eggs, in the Sunday morning experience. And as much as I love preaching, teaching, communicating, my gosh, I wouldn't be at the preaching masterclass if I didn't, at the end of the day, jesus put all of his eggs in the discipleship thing, of which teaching is a part. You know what I'm saying. So my experience with sanctification most people's experience isn't man, I came to an altar and, boom, the taste was taken out of my mouth. I stopped. No, it's. I may need to see some therapy. 07:47 While I sit in a small group, while I read my Bible, pray, you know what I'm saying. So it's much more robust, and so what that does for me as a communicator is I'm still going all out for it, but it takes a little bit of the pressure off. You know what I'm saying. Everything doesn't rise and fall on my 45 minutes. There's so much more that is going on, and so one of the things I think Ricky wanted me to reach back and grab is in the preaching moment. I try to have multiple conversations. Right, there's me trying to process where am I as it relates to my material, but I also want to internalize my material. Am I as it relates to my material? But I also want to internalize my material. I want to metabolize my material into the bloodstream of who I am, so that the Holy Spirit can say man, there's something happening here or I need you to go over here. 08:37 And then, even doing multiple services, I've had to learn the hard way that what works at the first service don't necessarily try to reproduce that in the second service, so I just need to be in the moment all the time. So good, yep. 08:49 - Speaker 3 I mean it's clear, pastor Ricky, as you walk around the corridors of this church which, by the way, has been designed impeccably it's the thought process behind it, and I know because of the amount of staff that I've engaged with over the last day and a half, and that starts with the top down, and you've got an incredible staff, your team. They serve well. Discipleship, to your point, is a key part of what's happening here. Talk about how important discipleship is here at Southwest Church. Well, I think any church. 09:21 - Speaker 1 You know and I got this from Bryan in Fellowship Memphis any church has to declare a North Star. There has to be a tip of the spear, or then everything's important. If everything's important nothing is. And I think I inherited a church that was really good at a lot and great at nothing, and so it had to be kind of a redefinition, according to the whole of Scripture, as to what is God's North Star for His church. And God's North Star is make disciples that can make disciples, great Commission, matthew 28 and all that good stuff. 09:54 So we had to ask the hard question what good things do we want to kill in Jesus' name, to make sure that the great thing which is disciple making wins thing, to make sure that the great thing which is disciple making wins? 10:06 And so we have really and it's been eight years of labor and all those good things, but by God's grace, right over the course of eight years, we think we're now on the cusp of seeing the fruit of what happens when a church says that what's ultimately important to God and so what's ultimately important to us, even if that means some good things we could be doing, we've said you know, we're going to let another church take that. 10:29 We're going to let a church do that, we are going to make disciples, and that unapologetically. And again it starts to you know, I've got elders who says you know what man, you've been preaching this for eight years and I just got it and you're like well, praise the Lord, brother. But I think that's the win of making sure that your program is God's program, making sure that your mission is God's mission. And I think after a while, if the leader is faithful to saying the same thing over and over again, perhaps in nuanced and different ways, to use Bryan verb, it starts to metabolize into the lifeblood of the church. And I think if the church does that, the rest is history. And we're seeing that here. We're seeing that. 11:14 - Speaker 3 I think what we're hearing is pruning. I host pastor's retreats and Dr Henry Cloud was with us. Oh yeah. 11:21 - Speaker 5 Necessary endings. 11:29 - Speaker 3 You know I've been in church, my PK, I've been in church, you know my whole life and it was the best word on pruning I'd ever heard. Pastor Bryan, how important is it for a leader to say it's good, but it's not great? Yeah, and I've got to prune that thing so that we can be more fruitful. Yeah, Well, that's exactly, and it's not just in church, I mean any organization, marketplace, people that are listening. 11:47 - Speaker 5 Yeah, that's exactly what Jesus does with us, right, john, chapter 15. And it's. But I think. I think what you really have to sell as the leader is the greater fruit, the greater harvest. The why almost has to become louder than the how, and the how is going to be really painful. But you got to really cast a vision for what we're going after. So I'm sure Ricky just didn't walk up in here and just start cutting programs and maybe some people. He had to cast some vision on some level. Maybe he wasn't ready to go public with the whole church, maybe his first concentric circles is hey, I got to have some conversations with the elder team, maybe with the staff team or whatever. But Jesus helps us to see what makes pruning palatable John 15, is I have a greater harvest of fruit. So this isn't punitive. It's not punitive, it's for a purpose, and Jesus cast that vision. So then when it's happening, I'm able to connect some dots even in the midst of my pain. So good. 12:54 - Speaker 1 Well, you know, even in that passage I prune them that it may bear more fruit, right, and I think, even when that starts to get real on the ground, right, so here's a leader, hey, I'm going to change your job so it can bear more fruit. That's a painful conversation. And then there's those at times where it's like, hey, I don't think this is where you're supposed to be, so you can bear more fruit. And man that's been the leadership throws here, is unapologetically saying we're going to do what's best for the church to accomplish her mission. But this is what I've noticed on the other side of hard conversations, painful conversations Everybody's bear more fruit, right, because we were paying attention to that mission. And I think the leader I think leaders should be comforted, never comfortable, right, and what I mean by that? We're comforted by the Holy Spirit, even in the midst of the throes of the things we have to change and do. 13:47 But I should never get comfortable with where we are. I think, as a leader, if you're at a place where it's like this is exactly how I want it, you need to retire. You ain't a leader. You're not a leader. That may be important because you're indicating something, and I think the leader is not the person who says how dare you do this. I says, hey, do we have good system? Do we have good people? Are we doing the things we need to do? And I'm using a metaphor on something very insignificant, but I think leaders are naturally nosy. I think leaders are. They're naturally nosy without being micro. You know what I mean. There's a dance there, but I'm concerned that we are bringing our best product to the for the Holy Spirit's access, so he can do with us what he wants to do. And I think a comfortable leader needs to resign, or you need to go on a vacation and get some rest to be able to come back at it, Because we want to push the agenda forward for God's kingdom. 14:55 - Speaker 3 When leaders are leading change. It's not an easy season, so where do leaders go to ensure that in the middle of the noise and the drain because those conversations are not easy conversations I mean I love the you know we're going to go take the mountain stuff, but I mean when you're leading and you're saying, hey, I'm going to release you to your destiny, right? Sure and that's just not here. 15:18 - Speaker 5 Sure. 15:19 - Speaker 3 Those are not easy conversations. They're people you've done life with. Yeah, where does a leader go to make sure that they don't just throw in the towel? They don't just. You know, the hardest part in leading change is not where you leave and it's not when you get there. It's that spot in the middle in the change deal. 15:38 - Speaker 1 Well, I really want Bryan to speak to this. He's got way more experience. But I do want to tell a story about how Bryan spoke into that. In a chapter of my life you used to always say I think you would say concentric circles. But health is man. There's a physical space, there's a emotional slash, mental space, and then there's spiritual right, my connection to Jesus, and if either one of those circles are fading, that spells unhealth and I can't do emotional, mental or spiritual by myself. That means I've got community accountability up and under. Uh, physical right, diet and exercise, all this kind of stuff Let me tell you about. 16:22 When I started working for Bryan, I was probably the place where emotionally mental, I was probably doing fair, maybe above average, and then spiritual I would say I was probably above average in those days. Physical was I had to be 315 pounds in those days. I'm 31, 32. Bryan says hey, doc, let's have breakfast at the Peabody this Saturday. Peabody Hotel, old World, high end, it's like interesting, while we're having breakfast it's so nice a spot, is what I'm thinking and we have breakfast, we sit down, have our breakfast, catching up, like always, and he says hey, man, um, I want to talk to you. You too big, that's a quote. 17:08 - Speaker 5 Brother, that's a quote. When I tell you I was rough around that I, I was going to say like there's no leading, don't copy that. 17:18 - Speaker 1 Don't copy that. Well, cool thing, I'm an engram aide, so I don't even think you love me if you don't cuss me out twice a year. So rigid is fine with me. And he said you too big, Ricky, don't get me wrong, I don't care how you look, I don't care, I love you just as you are. I want you to see your grandkids. And you said I'll pay for the gym, I'll pay for the physical trainer, I'll pay for the food, but whatever you need, I got you and I want to challenge you in that area of your life. 17:48 That was August of 2009. And you dropped a lot of weight. I dropped in the next four months. I dropped 90 pounds. Wow. Now I found most of them. So don't hear me say I was fixed forever. But there was an area of my emotional, spiritual, physical health that was a gift called awareness Right and one of those circles that I didn't have before that that I to this day and my point is this out excuse me, Bryan gonna speak to, I think, where leaders go. But man ain't no sense in going nowhere if, when you get back, you're not going to be taking care of those three areas zealously for yourself. 18:30 - Speaker 5 So that's been my reflection and I fight my body look, the older I get, the more I have choice words for Adam and the garden that was introduced into the world. But I heard a preacher say your ministry will only last as long as your body does. And then I read you know, you know that scene where Moses strikes the rock. I actually think that's a mental health episode. I think he just got so sick of people complaining, complaining, complaining that's right that they did it one more time and he snapped and that little episode barred him from the promised land. That's good. And so I just read that and I go. I mean, we heard earlier today, Bryan, you better guard your heart Right. 19:14 And a part of what that looks like for me is, among other things find a hobby and don't apologize for it, right. Find what brings you joy and put it on repeat. Obviously we understand responsibility, sure, sure we understand that kind of thing. I find most leaders, especially young leaders, don't give themselves permission to enjoy. And you got it for your own health and for your own soul. You got to do that. 19:45 - Speaker 3 So we're sitting here live at Preaching Masterclass. Why is this so important? I mean, in 30 years of ministry for me, I've been to lots of conferences, but there's a weightiness in this room that's just a little different. I mean, I walked out of worship Matt Redman was leading. I walked back in. Something had shifted in the room. 20:08 - Speaker 5 Jonathan McReynolds was on the stage. Jonathan McReynolds. 20:11 - Speaker 3 I mean, it was just like I think Pastor Albert had made his own altar call somewhere down front and he was laying out on his feet. So why is this something that should be on leaders' calendars to get to? Because this doesn't feel like just a rah-rah conference. It feels like there's something else that's in the air, there's a weightiness that's in this room. That's just different. 20:38 - Speaker 5 Well, part of what I like, which probably isn't exactly what you're speaking to, but the uniqueness of it for me. Having gone to a few different preaching conferences, I just love the favorite part where a person will preach and then right afterwards there's an interview. It's like you just ate the meal and now I'm back in the kitchen with the chef. Okay, who's walking me through their process? How they approach it, the why behind you know the psychology of how they presented the message. That is gold, yes, and it's like 25 to 30 minutes of hearing that. That's why I wanted my son to be here. You know he can podcast great preaching and for sure there's things that are happening in the room, which are phenomenal. 21:23 I also wanted him to be exposed to not just the labs, but hearing how these amazing communicators approach things. 21:34 - Speaker 1 Yeah, I'll draw something out of that too. I think that's the uniqueness of preaching master's class, is everything that Bryan just said. I want to tease that out further. Preaching master's class is a permission conference, and what I mean by that is there's experiences where you can work on, mechanics you can work on. Hey here, buy these illustrations, here's some outlines and here's some setup and here's explanation illustration. We've been there and done that with homiletics and that's all good. 22:15 Transcendence is the new commodity of the church. Content is free. I can literally go to ChatGBT right now and I can give ChatGBT 10 YouTube links of Bryan Loritts, 10 of Tony Evans, 10 of Albert Tate and 10 of Gardner C Taylor and say write a sermon on Ezekiel, chapter 34, and their voices, and I'll have a perfect sermon in 30 minutes. So that can't be what it's about, you know, because anybody can do that. So I think the reason churches are swelling up now is not for content. It's for something they can't get on ChatGBT, something they can't get in a podcast, something they can't get in their authenticity of a transcendent moment happening in real time and space, because culture is running out of those spaces and the church. That's the only thing we know how to do well, and so I think it's a moment that preaching master's class has learned how to package and produce. And to Bryan point, it happens after the sermon where we're all just like, oh my gosh. But now, transcendently, after the sermon, we're all just like, oh my gosh, but now, transcendently, I get to speak to the preacher. While they're there, I get to ask them a question while they're there, I get to get her or him to speak to it, to me, and there's an exchange that is happening in that space, and I think the root word is permission. 23:40 I think Megan Faith this morning gave everyone permission to go do that. I think Bryan LaRitz last night gave everyone permission to go do that. I think Bryan LaRitz last night gave everyone permission to go. Do that because it takes the mystique out of it, it takes the mystery out of it. We're sitting down in the living room chair and he's telling me huh, okay, I can do that too, because if I just watch Bryan LaRitz preach and this is me and Albert's testimony if I just watch Bryan LaRitz preach, man, I wish I could do that. It must be nice. But when he sits down in a living room chair and said, no, I did this. Then I thought that, oh, you just broke down that gourmet meal. It's gourmet, but it's really. You went to the same grocery store I can go to and I can buy that. I mean, I put it together the same way, but I can go buy it and I can figure it out, and I can try it a few times until it tastes just like yours. 24:26 - Speaker 4 Or it just tastes like the way. 24:27 - Speaker 2 I do it. 24:29 - Speaker 1 I think that's huge man. And you know, Bryan, you go everywhere. I don't know a space. No, I don't. That does this. I don't Like this. 24:36 - Speaker 3 Yeah, on the craft of preaching. I mean, I heard a long time ago I was in a room and Bishop Jake said you're changing the oil on the showroom floor. You still working through your message. It's only half baked by first service. Maybe by the third service you go, but you're working through it. How important is it to work on the craft, the skill of preaching, teaching, communicating to be an effective leader? 25:06 - Speaker 5 Look, athletes have a saying. Aaron Donald, the great lineman for the Rams, everybody's like what are you doing? You're at the top of your game and you're retiring. And Aaron pretty much said I've gotten to the point where I want to take shortcuts in my preparation and the moment I want to cheat the game, cheat the process, is the moment I need to get out of the game. For me, having done this for 35 years, I'm at a dangerous place where I got an amazing back catalog of stuff and I've just preachers at my age, at my stage. They tend to either plateau or decline, and I get it Because we're as busy as we'll ever be. We've got this amazing backlog of stuff and it's just easy to reach and cut that illustration from there now and I have to force myself as never before to put the work in. I keep telling myself don't cheat the game, don't cheat the game. And that's what I want to encourage this generation and I'm not anti-AI, which might surprise people, I am anti-AI first. That should be towards the end. 26:22 Tim Keller said the internet is the friend of information, the enemy of thought, and I think we have to work really hard and to put up appropriate boundaries that guarantee our thoughtful engagement with the text and that other stuff is just mere supplemental. So I've got to put the work in and I'm not. So let me say something that's going to sound like I'm contradicting. I actually think some young preachers put too much work in. You're pastoring a church, not a church service. Okay, so this nonsense. They feed you in seminary about 40 hours a week. You ain't spending 40 hours a week, that's right. I think you should give yourself an eight to 12 hour window and at some point, okay, that's enough and I need to go to the hospital, I need to go sit with some people, I need to go spend some time with my wife, my kids. So I don't want you to hear by work. I'm not saying 40 hours, but I'm also saying put your time in, yes, and have the process, yeah. 27:25 - Speaker 1 I think that's brilliant, I think it's prescient for the room that we were just with. The average guy or gal out there is probably more like maybe a team pastor, a high school pastor, you know what I mean. So I think some of that. I think there's a lot of bivocational people in there. To Bryan point For me and where I sit, I think if you love preaching and are thereby called to it, you are naturally working on bettering it. Right, like you're net, like there's often to this purity factor there. So that happens a lot. 28:01 I think I've become a different. They say you change, you become a new preacher every 300th sermon. Right, and so I've. I've known, I've witnessed that I am not what I was five years ago, you know, and so all of that. But my encouragement to Bryan point is and this is just where I'm at, I'm just testifying for Ricky Jenkins I want to be a great preacher. I'd rather have a great church. You know what I'm saying so like, and I'm not saying this we want to be a great preacher. Some guys pick one. I get that. I've kind of made up my mind. I just want a great church. I'm good enough. You know like I know who I am and I think that's 48 talking. You know what I'm saying, but this is what I do know. I don't care if, even if I did just want to be a great preacher as far as the fruit and leverage factor is, I can probably only leverage or scale my preaching gift Maybe three X. 29:04 That will translate into kingdom fruit Maybe, maybe somebody can do a 5X. You know what I'm saying. I think Tony Evans did a 5X and all those people. 29:11 - Speaker 5 Well, it's different capacities, right. It's like one talent, two talent, five talent. 29:16 - Speaker 1 We got a number on our back, you know. But my systems I can scale them at least 10. At least, and then I can create a new one that can scale that even further. So I think for the bivocational person, for the high school pastor, for the team pastor, that's why I'm so heavy on getting that other stuff so organized so you're not putting so much pressure on your preaching. Craig Groeschel what largest church in America? Or second largest, maybe it's still Gateway, whatever, craig is good. Craig is real good. He ain't that good. Like Craig preaches a good message. That dude has that sucker organized to get 100,000 people. Because let me tell you, I love Craig Groeschel. His gift ain't 100,000 people Right, his system is Right, and so I think that's a gift that Preaching Masters class is giving to these leaders, where they really start to leverage their voice and see what their voice has potential on, because it's not as much pressure on it. 30:16 - Speaker 3 So that's why I'm passionate about that. So in 30 seconds, you and I are the same age I'm 48. I've also just I just lost 75 pounds over the last year. Man congratulations so you know, to your point. 30:28 - Speaker 1 That's awesome, man. 30:29 - Speaker 3 I had my pastor, pastor Albert, say hey, you know you need to handle this, did he say? 30:34 - Speaker 1 you too B it wasn't. 30:36 - Speaker 3 You know. I'll say this I was in the hospital. I was in the hospital, just had my yeah, just had my yeah, and it was not what I wanted to hear. Let's just put it that way. It wasn't as harsh as Pastor Bryan. Obviously he does not have the gift of compassion. 30:51 - Speaker 5 I received it. That's all that matters. Now we used to joke if I'm visiting in a hospital. They're about to pull the plug, yeah exactly you might be there to pull the plug. 30:58 - Speaker 3 Sounds like you're the one about yanking the plug, but you just told a leader that's listening, watching this right now, in 30 seconds, about them being healthy. Whether they're in marketplace leadership, they're leading an NGO, a nonprofit, pastoring, whatever area of leadership they're in, you need to be healthy. What would that one thing you would tell that leader to ensure he does, so that they're healthy? 31:24 - Speaker 5 Comprehensively healthy or specific kind of health. 31:28 I'll leave it up to you, pastor Bryan. Well, listen, I think there's many factors that go into that. I think the number one thing I would point to outside of a walk with Christ is a solid, authentic community of people around you, and what I mean by. I've been in this thing long enough to see, unfortunately, many leaders implode, yeah, and when you do the autopsy, what gets them is never the affair, it's never the money, it's never they weren't known, like they didn't have people around them to say I think you're doing too much, or y'all been spending a lot of time together and I don't think like they weren't really known. 32:16 It's amazing how many places I go to and I get introduced by the pastor, my good friend. I'm like, really we talk once a year. Right, my good friend. I'm like really we talk once a year. 32:34 - Speaker 1 So I would say, and even psychologists would say this, one of the benchmarks for health is rich, life-giving relationships. If I had to say one thing, I would say remember the Sabbath and keep it holy. Yes, 100%. You read your Old Testament and keep it holy. Yes, 100%, you read your Old Testament. The years of exile God punished them with was commensurate to how many Sabbaths they missed. Right, so they go to the Sabbath. They were supposed to let the land rest every seventh year and if you do the math over the hundreds of years of existence, God made them stay in Babylon, respectful of the years of Sabbath that they hadn't taken, and you dial that back right to the weekly basis. I just know from my own story. 33:13 Covid hits maybe two weeks out of a month. I do a Sabbath, but even that was rushed to, not intentional. My life changed and what springs out of a consistent Sabbath? Well, I've had a deep, meaningful engagement with myself and with my Savior. My body is rested. Don't make trust any decision you make when you're tired. My anxiety level is down. I'm a better Ricky for April, a better Ricky for those three kids and a better Ricky for this team. I'm a better Ricky for April, a better Ricky for those three kids and a better Ricky for this team. So I would encourage leaders that if you're making an excuse for Sabbath and there's work that's more important than Sabbath you have missed the God of rest, hebrews 4. 33:58 - Speaker 3 So that's my story and I think those are intertwined community and Sabbath, but man yeah, Well, and, by the way, it's clear you live that because I actually spoke to a staff member who literally told me he was like, yeah, I came in, stopped by the office on my day off and I was rebuked by my senior pastor and he was a staff here. So it is clear. So thank you for your transparency. Thank you both for your honesty. Pastor Bryan, Pastor Ricky, love you both. You both are just incredible, incredible leaders. Thank you for sharing this time with all of you. Faithly podcast preaching masterclass. It's been an incredible time. Continue to follow us at faithlyco. God bless you. 34:40 - Speaker 4 Thank you for tuning in to the Faithly Stories podcast. 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