On the Other Side of Fear - Willie Alfonso

00:00 - Speaker 1 People think that when you come to the Lord, you know you ever meet some of these pastors. They say Hallelujah, praise the Lord, come on to Jesus, everything's going to be all right. That's a lie. It's just an outright lie. You come to Jesus, everything's not going to be okay, man, you know. But I mean I'd rather go through what I'm going through with Him than by myself. Right, you know what I'm saying, but I can't allow the things that are coming my way to rob me of my joy. 00:30 - Speaker 2 Welcome to Faithly Stories, the podcast that brings you inspiring tales from conversations with church leaders as they navigate the peaks and valleys of their faith journeys through their ministry work and everyday life. Join us as we delve into their challenges, moments of encouragement and answered prayers. The Faithly Stories podcast is brought to you by Faithly, an online community committed to empowering church leaders, pastors, staff and volunteers. Learn more at faithlyco. Get ready to be uplifted and inspired as we unveil the heart of faith through stories from the front lines of ministry. On the Faithly Stories podcast. 01:12 - Speaker 3 Welcome to Faithly Stories. My name is Pastor Adam Durso and I am sitting alongside the founder and CEO of Faithly, alicia Lee, and to my left here is Chaplain Willie Alfonso, my guy, my man, chaplain to the New York Yankees and the Brooklyn Nets. But it didn't start with that kind of pedigree. It didn't start with you'd be on private jets and with the Yankee brass, and yet your story is really a miraculous story of the saving power of Almighty God. Why don't you tell the audience a little bit of your background and how all that started? 01:47 - Speaker 1 Yeah, Well, you know, I'm a New Yorker, 150% New Yorker, Brooklyn boy. There you go. Grew up in Memphis, Diverson, Williamsburg East, New York. 01:57 - Speaker 3 Pre-gentrified, not like today. No, no. 02:01 - Speaker 1 It's called inner city. When I was growing up it was called a ghetto. And you know, come a family of seven, four girls, three boys, my mom, my dad. My father was probably one of the most evilest men you could find on the face of the earth. He beat my mother every day. He was an alcoholic, he'd get drunk every day. Beat my mom, he would an alcoholic, he'd get drunk every day. Beat my mom, he would beat us. 02:34 You know, I was watching the movie Fences with Denzel Washington and the boy that played his son made a statement that ran chill down my spine. He said to Denzel you know, when you just walked by and I saw your shadow, the fear would come at me. And that's exactly how I felt when my father walked by. When he walked by and I saw his shadow alone, your fear would come all over me because he would beat us. My brother and I would take our bureau and put it against our door and put empty Coca-Cola and 7-Up cans. So if we were sleeping and he tried to get in, those cans would fall and wake us up and we knew to run behind the door. When he came in we'd run out. And so, you know, I think like five years old, I saw him beat my mother and I would say one day I'm going to grow up, I'm going to man up, I'm going to take care of this dude, I. And one day I'm going to grow up, I'm a man, I'm going to take care of this dude. I said it when I was five, seven, eight, nine, 10. 03:31 When I was 11, that day came. He came in, he was drunk. We got into an argument. He picked up a broom to hit her and I rolled up on him and I hit him and he fell and he ran out and for me, I mean, that was the happiest day of my life, man, he was gone. But three days later my mother came up to me and said we have a little problem here. Your father's coming back under one condition you got to go. 03:57 But where? So 11 years old, 11 years old. So I'm in the street. I've slept in abandoned buildings and wake up in the morning because rats were batting my feet. I've lived in cardboard boxes. I started sniffing glue, sniffing cabona, drinking cheap wine, smoking reefer, snorting, heroin, skin popping, mainlining in heroin and cocaine. That became my habit. I get clean, go back. 04:28 I met a girl, my wife Nancy, that we celebrated last week 55 years married Congratulations. My greatest testimony of life period is married to this wonderful, beautiful woman that just loved me unconditionally and never left me. I would have left me a long time ago. Yet she stayed. And even after I hooked up and got married and had two kids, I still struggled with drugs and I never went to school, didn't know how to read, didn't know how to write. But if you taught me something I could do it because I wasn't stupid. So someone taught me how to run a printing machine. So I'm running a printing machine in a brokerage house and there was like 60 employees, black and Hispanics. And one day they hired a new supervisor, blonde hair, blue eyed, German, white boy and I said man, I'm going to eat this boy up. 05:20 So, he came up to me, shook my hand. When he shook my hand, he held it a little too tight. I didn't like it. He told me I want to tell you that Jesus loves you. And he opened up the Bible, read me a verse. And I said, man, this is like one sick white dude. But he would come every single morning and he'd tell me Willie, you know, I want to tell you Jesus loves you. Read me a verse. And after a while it wasn't funny. No more to me. So I just grabbed this Bible, took it to the glue machine and I glued this Bible. And he came, looked at the Bible, went to the cutter, cut it here, cut it here, cut it here. And opened it up, shook my hand, told me Jesus loved me. Long story short, he left. I was strung out. He gave me his number. I called him. He invited me to church. 06:02 So I went to church with my wife in the morning and then I felt this overwhelming sense to go back in the evening. Back in those days you had church in the morning, had church in the evening. You remember that, pastor Sure. And so I went by myself in the evening. I sat all the way in the back of the church and I made this deal with God. I said God, jesus, whatever your name is, personally I think you're a hustle, but I ain't got nothing to lose, man. My wife's going to leave me. I've strung out. If you are who people tell me you are and you could do what people tell me you could do, you could help me get this habit off my back. No one will ever serve you like me. 06:42 And I started going to church. Wow, you know, I started going to church. My pastor wanted me to get baptized. I said no, because you got to read this booklet I can't read. So he got a teacher, retired teacher, angelica Valentin, for three years tutored me, taught me how to read. I took the GD test six times. Wow, I would show up. They would tell me Mr Alfonso, you're back. I was back. A bunch of haters, yeah, it's a problem, you know. 07:08 Passed it and just started this journey with God, you know, and started teaching Sunday school, started doing prison ministry. I felt a calling in my life, you know. Well, no, live back up. My mentor told me I had a calling. I didn't even know what that was. I told him I had a calling, you know. He explained it to me and so I went on a couple of missions trips thinking maybe mission, that wasn't it. 07:34 I started doing prison ministry and then I had an opportunity to go with a young man, you know him, dave Bottle. Yeah yeah, dave Bottle, my Sunday school student, and his wife Rebecca, when they were in junior high and high school. He planted the church through the CMA, christian Missionary Alliance and I went with him, became an associate pastor and started pastoring in the projects running basketball leagues. We had over 200 boys, 125 boys, in our basketball league. To play you had to come to devotion. If you didn't come, you didn't play. It wasn't a democracy, it was a dictatorship, it was ruled and we sent a lot of boys to Nia College, sure. And then I met a gentleman called George McGovern. You know, george, he's an area coordinator for Athletes in Action, a ministry of former Campus Committee for Christ, now CRU, and he said you know, would you like to come to Yankee Stadium and do a chapel? 08:35 - Speaker 2 And. 08:36 - Speaker 3 I said the birds fly. 08:37 - Speaker 1 So I find myself in Yankee Stadium and I came the year that Jeter came there's Derek Jeter and there's Paul O'Neill and there's Scott Brocious and this is crazy and he needed an assistant. So I went with Athletes in Action. You had to raise support. I couldn't raise it, so I became an associate, which allowed me to minister in other places. The following year, mariano Rivera came, you know, and Mo and I today, with brothers, we spent maybe 12, 14 years doing a one-on-one Bible study in this $10 million mansion. 09:18 Imagine I used to live in a cardboard box, you know, homeless, and I'm sitting in a $12 million mansion doing a Bible study with the greatest relief picture ever in the history of baseball. That's true, I'm not that smart man, god, you know. As a matter of fact, I think it was like five years after we were doing that, I said hey, mo, say thank you Jesus. He said why? I said, bro, just say it, just say thank you Jesus. Why you Jesus? Why I said stop being a hardhead, dude, just say it. He said thank you Jesus. Why? Thank you Jesus? I don't get high no more, brother, because I would have robbed you blind. You got some good stuff in here, man. Nothing here is cheap. I would have backed up the truck and emptied your house. And then I started. George McGovern turned over the Nets the Brooklyn Nets. 10:02 - Speaker 3 Well Jersey, Nets Jersey. 10:03 - Speaker 1 Nets back then, you know, in the IZOC Center. They went to the Prudential Center, then to Brooklyn. I was with them 22 years, went to two championships with them. Byron Scott, former Laker, to today one of my dearest friends, jason Kidd. One of my dearest friends Played golf with him, alonzo Mourning. I led Alonzo Mourning to the Lord. 10:25 - Speaker 3 And really walked him through that. 10:27 - Speaker 1 Yeah, when he had the kidney surgery, I went to visit him. And well, let me back up. When he first came to the Nets, I came up to him, he was sitting down. I stuck my hand out. I said, mr Mourning, my name is Pastor William Chaplin here. Welcome to the Nets. And he just looked at me and said, hmm, and he was taller than me sitting. 10:48 And so when a 6'10", 335-pound black brother go. Hmm, that means leave me alone. I came back another time he said the same thing. I left him alone, but I made friends with his bodyguard and the bodyguard was going through some issues and I helped him walk through them. And so when he had the kidney surgery I woke up in the morning I saw God telling me to go visit him. I said but God, the brother says, hmm. 11:18 So I called Bobby Marks, a traveling secretary, found out where he was, went and guess who was deciding who went in and who didn't? The bodyguard Wow, it was a setup man, yeah, you know. And I went in and we called him Zoe and Zoe had a smile. He said hey, pastor, woody, how you doing. And I got ticked off. I said I guess there's something about dying that now you don't mind seeing the pastor. We talked for a while and, as I'm walking away, I said Joe, can I ask you a question? And he said yeah. I said what are you going to do about Jesus? He said well, brother, you don't understand what I've done. So I sat back down and shared my story with him and he gave his life to the Lord. Wow, and for the next what six or seven months that he was still with. I went to his house and we did a Bible study together. Imagine I live in a cardboard box. 12:06 I went to one of the greatest power forwards ever in the history of basketball. He writes a book in chapter 10. It's all about our friendship. Wow, he goes to the Hall of Fame, he invites Nancy Knight to be there and in his acceptance speech he says that guy there, pastor Willie, he led me to God. It's crazy man. Wow, you know they go. He went back to the Miami Heat. They went to the championship. He flew me down to be there that day. It's just a crazy journey. You know the last guy that should be doing this. But I've learned that's the way God operates. The least person you think is the person he'll use, you know. And today I'm on the Campus Pastor Team Challenge. I'm working with men of addiction. I love doing it. 12:58 - Speaker 3 So, in all of this, you're now a two-time author and the name of your first book which has your testimony in it, is it's A New Beginning. And where can people find that, if they want to, they can? 13:09 - Speaker 1 go to Amazon, you know CanDo. There's also a study book to it, also that I wrote. Those are the first two books. 13:18 - Speaker 3 And you and Mo administered to men literally around the globe. I mean, your story has inspired me and now we've got a second book on the other side of fear, and with that I'm going to toss it over to you, Alicia, to walk us through just how impactful this book has been on you personally as you started reading it. 13:38 - Speaker 4 Yeah, thank you so much, Pastor Willie. You know, what I'll start with first is just something you said about being with Alonzo Mourning and asking him this question what are you going to do about Jesus? I've never heard anyone ask it in that way before. What a powerful question. What are you going to do about Jesus? 13:57 - Speaker 1 It's what I ask all the athletes I work with. You know I first try to you know you have to earn the right to speak into their life. Sure, a lot of people think that because you know the Lord, you automatically have the right. No, you don't. 14:10 - Speaker 3 You got a title or something you have to earn that right, you know. 14:14 - Speaker 1 And so after we've earned the right and we talk a little bit and maybe play some golf or something you know, I'll ask them. You know, brother, it's the question man, what are you going to do about Jesus? Man, I love that. 14:26 - Speaker 4 I love that because it's like a you can't say. It's not a yes or no question, it's a question that demands a response and demands action. 14:34 - Speaker 1 That's why I say that I love it. Yeah, I want an answer. 14:40 - Speaker 4 As I read your book, I felt this sense of urgency from you, the kind of urgency you sense from the Apostle Paul when he's writing his letters. You have a message to share with the church. 14:47 - Speaker 1 Yeah, how can I put it? It's a little controversial for people, okay. So I'm trying to find a balance. But who I am, I am, so I'm going to say what I'm going to say. So I'm fighting that and I'm trying to make sure that it's pleasing God, that I'm not bad-mouthing anyone, that I'm not trying to hurt anyone. 15:17 I definitely did not want to write about being molested at all, matter of fact. I had totally forgot. I put it back in my brain and put it in the back of my brain and the Lord brought it back to my brain and for over a year and a half he had been haunting me, you know, to, to to write this and I've been bugging him, matter of fact. At one time I even told him you could punish me if you want. I'm not going to write it, you know. And then think about my daughter. You know, being gay didn't want to write it, but I called her, you know, and I said to her you know, it's just okay. And she said I know you're not going to demonize me and I said no, I'm not. So you know, it's been a journey in my mind, my heart and my spirit. But once I felt that I had to, then I went for it. Yeah, yeah. 16:06 - Speaker 4 Yeah Well, you went for it and it's really powerful because you laid bare your hurt, your experience. You were really vulnerable and I think that is the thing that gives other people a chance to bring their hurt to the table, to put it before the Lord, and I just I thought it was so powerful. I also I was surprised because, knowing your history and knowing what you've done for a living for decades, I thought it was going to be a book about sports and faith. But as I started reading it, I realized no, this is a book about the church. 16:39 - Speaker 1 Yeah, I try to stay away from sports all the time because if you get to know me, really really know me, I am one of the most loyal person you will ever find. I am loyal, loyal and I'm not going to write about athletes. I'm not going to write about that their privacy. You know I'm not going to write about those things. Before I wrote this book, a publisher wanted to give me $75,000. And he told me don't write this book, write a sports faith book. And I told him no Matter of fact, I hired an agent and I fired her because I told her this is not what I asked you for, because they wanted a gospel book. I'm not going to do that For no kind of money. You could offer me a million dollars. I won't do it because I'm loyal to the work that God gave me and the privacy of the work God gave me and these men. You know I'm used to not going to do it, but then I decided I needed to write this. 17:46 - Speaker 4 Well, so it's a book about the church. It's also a book about resilience. You said forgiveness forges resilience. And you said resilience is only learned through withstanding pressure without breaking, without hardening your heart. And you said to be resilient is to be found faithful. And I thought, wow, like this is a life's work for you to find your resilience and for you to give that message to your leaders. 18:14 - Speaker 1 You know I love the verse from the Apostle Paul in Philippians 3, I think it's verse 12 or 13. You know he says I don't understand it all. There's one thing I do understand I'm going to put the past behind me and I'm going to move forward with what God asked me Now. Now, that's easiest said than done. Sure, okay, because of all the crap on it that comes, but you got to get to a point of not allowing the crap to overtake your life and overtake your heart. Dr Bernard's son, jamal yeah, jamal, excuse me, he said something and it stayed with me and I mentioned it in the book. You know, your heart is not a cemetery To take these resentments and put them in your heart. Now your heart is full of resentment, toothed bones and there's no room for God. So I've learned how to forgive. You know, even my father father remarried a Philippines girl. My father was a merchant streamer, so he bought this Philippine girl from Philippines, beat the crap out of her too, abused her. They had a daughter, my stepsister Linda. I didn't even know I had a stepsister. 19:19 While he was asleep, light a flute on him to light him up. He woke up, the state took her away and he was living in Spanish Harlem and he was opening up the window, there was too much heat and he had a brain aneurysm and he fell behind the sofa with his face and shoulder on the radiator for three days. So my mother called me and said he's in the hospital dying and I'm a pastor, now right? And I said well, I don't really care, I hope he drops dead. My brother, andy, calls me up, my oldest brother, which I love. I love my oldest brother, and he convinced me to go. 19:54 So we went, go to second floor, room 228, you know, and I said look, and there he is. I hadn't seen him in maybe 30-something years, my brother and my baby sister. And we Puerto Ricans, when we see a family member, we say bendición, which means bless me, and the response is que Dios te bendiga favorezca. May God bless you and favor you. So he was in a coma. But my baby sister said papi, bendición. He said que Dios te bendiga favorezca, and God tells me now tell about me. And I said you must be out of your mind. I ain't saying jack, I ain't saying nothing, I wanted to go to hell and I felt God say to me well, you were going to that same hell, but you're not because of me, wow. So I went. He was there, I was here. 20:44 My brother's sister was there and I said look, man, what's gone on, gone on. Put it behind us. I forgive you, but the issue here is you're going to die and you need to get right with God before you die. But he fell into a coma again. So I said I'm going to pray for you and if you want to receive the Lord, move your hands up there. And he moved his hand. Wow, and two hours later he died. Wow. So I told my brothers and sisters let's bury him with the dignity he never gave us. Wow, and that's what we did. 21:19 I can only control what I do. I'm going to be 74. My parents not one time ever told me they loved me. Not one time. I'm not bitter about it. What's done is done. You know, pastor Paul says put it behind you, but I can show you my phone Every single day. I text my daughters and tell them I love them. Every single day I text my two grandchildren and tell them I love them. Every single day I text my two grandchildren and tell them I love them. 21:51 My wife and I are married 75 years and you just see us. We're like honeymooners. We love each other, we care for each other. See that I control. You know that I control. 22:03 So why should I go into a woe with me party about what happened? It happened. I need to move on with what God has for me now and not allow the enemy to embitter my heart, right? Because, look, I was mad at my father for those 30 years. I was. If I ever saw him, I would kill him and I would gladly go to jail Every day I was bitter. This man wasn't even thinking about me who lost. 22:40 I did so I've decided I'm not doing that, no more. You know I'm going to Whatever comes my way. You know, I'm just not going to allow it to embitter my heart. And people think that when you come to the Lord you know, I meet some of these pastors they say Hallelujah, praise the Lord, come on to Jesus, everything's going to be alright. That's a lie. It's just an outright lie. You come to Jesus, everything's not going to be all right. That's a lie. It's just an outright lie. You come to Jesus, everything's not going to be okay, man, you know. But I mean I'd rather go to what I'm going to with him than by myself. Right, you know what I'm saying, but I can't allow the things that are coming my way to rob me of my joy. I can't. 23:28 - Speaker 3 I've had a front row seat to that chapel way. I mean, my wife and I have known you and Nancy and Kristen, the family for over 20 years, 25 years, yeah. And you were at the church where I was pastoring with my dad for many of those years 13 years, yeah. So it was up close and I saw different aspects of trouble and difficulty, like you just alluded to, whether it was in the church world or in your family and outside the church world, and you never walked away from the Lord. You never walked away, not only from the Lord, but there are guys who say, well, I didn't walk away from the Lord, but I left the church. You didn't even leave the church. Explain that to me. How do you distinctly understand that I can trust Jesus even though the church, his body, is imperfect? 24:16 I used to live in a cardboard box. 24:18 - Speaker 1 Man, I used to wake up in the morning and kick rats away, you know, and look what God has done. How in the world can I have a bitter heart? You know, and I'm a big boy. I'm a big boy. What comes comes, you know, and I deal with it, knowing that he's with me. When Always he's not a with me, when Always he's not a part-time. God Always, yeah, and you know, it's like. You know. 24:53 I remember the story of King Jehoshaphat. You know three armies coming against him. Sure, what did he do? First thing he did, he went to the Lord. The second thing he did was he brought the people of the kingdom to come and pray and fast. But then he did something that for me is so significant, man, he started remembering all the times God had bailed him out. And so when things happen, I start remembering of all the times that God had bailed me out. Man, he's been there. So why in the world am I going to get him better? I know I got a God that got my back. Yes, always had my back. Yes, even when I didn't know him, he had my back. 25:34 I trust the Lord. I do, I honestly do, and if people will come to a place of just no matter what situation man comes, god's with you. Yes, no matter what situation man comes, god with you. Yes, he got you. You know he got you and I feel every day the presence of God. You know, whenever I get hurt in a church, the next Sunday I'm in another church. You know, I have buddies. You know. One of my friends says stay here until you find what God wants you. Yeah, you know. So I stay there and he's my pastor. I no longer call him by his name, I call him pastor. 26:09 - Speaker 4 Mm-hmm. 26:10 - Speaker 1 You know, and then when we find a plan, I'm going through that now. You know, I moved to Jersey and so I'm looking for a church. I've been going to one church but I decided not to stay there. So we're looking, but until we find I'm going to stay there, you know, because you need to be accountable. Sure, you know I go to midweek prayer meetings when I can. When I'm not speaking, because it's not about me, you know, it's about the Lord. That's awesome. 26:37 - Speaker 4 I think that one of the reasons the Lord has given you these incredible opportunities right and has asked you to write this book is because you're willing to say the things that other people aren't willing to say. There are lots of pastors and lots of leaders talking about joy. There are lots of leaders, lots of pastors, talking about forgiveness, and those are really important things that you talk about also, but I think people need to hear that it is a journey to get to those places. A lot of hard stuff happens on the way to those places, and you are bold and you are courageous and you talk about those things. I think that's what gives people hope that perhaps joy is within their reach, perhaps forgiveness. 27:13 - Speaker 1 Everybody wants to get to the mountaintop, but no one wants to start in the valley. I've learned very little to nothing on the mountaintop. 99.99% of what I've learned I've learned in the valley. Don't duck the valley. The valley is there for a purpose. It teaches them things. Most of all, god's testing your faithfulness. What the church needs today is transparency yes, from their leaders. You know, hey guys, we're in the prayer meeting. I want you to know that I'm struggling, man, but they're afraid that someone's going to think they're not spiritual enough. Right, you know, and I'm not spiritual enough. Let's just get you know I'm not. I'm not spiritual enough, man. You got to trust God, but the journey is difficult at times and sometimes it's very difficult. And if you could get through it, man, you come out a different person. 28:13 - Speaker 4 Yes, there's a story you tell in the book that I thought was super powerful about starting the Spanish chapel right, but not really speaking Spanish all that well. That resonated with me because I, like you, I grew up speaking Chinese, learned English in school and then my Chinese got kind of not so good and for me there came a time where I had to use my Chinese in ministry and I did not feel good about it. I felt silly, I felt like no one's going to understand me. I felt weak. And you said in your book well, in your saying yes and putting your weakness right out there, the Lord really threw open the doors for you, yeah, yeah, I remember one time, you know, I said something. 28:59 - Speaker 1 He said what gibberish, you know what gibberish is? That man, you know, and I kind of, you know, got a little cold. And Robinson Cano, ah, leave him alone, man, you know. You know we're not paying him, you know, but from through it, you know, to showing these guys my weakness but being willing to still do it, they saw something they never saw before, you know, and through it, mariano Rivera and I started. 29:36 There was no chaplain Hispanic and today 95% of minor league and major league have chaplain Hispanics and the reason is because 95% of the chaplains were white and they didn't associate with a lot of Hispanic people. You know, but we've changed it. I'm the first Hispanic Major League chaplain in Major League Baseball, you know. And then I went in there and I would talk and I, you know, and Mo would bail me out, you know, and this will bail me out and that will bail me out, and we would laugh, man, and we used to meet once a month in Mariano's house You've gone to those right and we would have a big Bible study. I would bring some worship group there. Imagine I'm running the show. 30:21 God, he used to live in a God. He's living a couple. He's sniffing loot it's Nash Pocketbooks. You know I'm running this show and I just felt so empowered by God. You know that as long as I didn't drift from God Look, I went to spring training for 28 years with the Yankees I could have stayed in the hotel where the players stay, but I never did, not one time, because in the lobby there was nothing but women and I didn't want to get caught up. I would drive after Bible study, maybe 10 o'clock at night, and sometimes we had it in most house. I would drive from Tampa to Ocala an hour and a half. I would stay with my brother and then get up at six in the morning to drive back. But I was safe. I didn't want to bring death into my home. I didn't want to dishonor my wife. Someone would say man, pastor Willie, what you don't have the control to. No, nope, yeah, okay. 31:29 - Speaker 4 Now what I don't, you know, I don't think there's a man alive they could handle that I think when you've suffered um, you learn to count the cost of the decisions that you may yes make and, um, you did it. 31:47 you know by choosing what hotels that you stayed in. You knew the price that you would have to pay and you did it with drugs. Also. There's a part in your book where you talk about the chronic pain that you're suffering and just like making the decision, like, yeah, I could take this drug to make all the pain just go away, like that, but I know the price. 32:05 - Speaker 1 Yeah, I had a knee replacement eight years ago and for me that cord was called chronic pain syndrome. I got to have a battery here, have a computer chip attached to my main nerve and through my phone here I could control the pain. But it doesn't take all the pain away, and sometimes, especially in the cold, the pain gets so bad and I'm not a guy that cries very easy, but the pain is so bad that it puts me in tears. All I have to do is buy an Oxy. I know where to buy them. If I want drugs, I know where to get them. But if I take an Oxy it's going to wake up in my brain, that part that wants the drugs again. 32:55 All right, so okay, this pain is gone. But now I gave birth to a whole different pain and so I'd rather go through this pain. You know I've had nine different procedures. None have worked, None. And so I've come to a place where I've told God you know, I'm not going to try anything, no more, it is what it is, I'll bite the bullet and I'll get through it. You know, last year I'm I was out sick, zero for me. It's my way of kicking the devil in the behind. You know, saying you don't got me, brother, you know, nah, you know. And so and I tell the guy at the Teen Challenge you know I'm in pain, but I can't do that. 33:46 - Speaker 4 So let's talk about Teen Challenge for a second. 33:48 - Speaker 1 What happened was that the director of Teen Challenge New Jersey asked me would I speak at their banquet? And I said okay, had a big banquet. Then he gave me a check for $875 and I signed it and gave it back to him. I said I don't take money from rehab centers. I'm an ex-drug addict. I'm going to take money from you guys. Whoever takes checks, man, shame on them. And I gave it back to him. So then he asked me would I come and speak at the septum? I did, and then he asked me would I consider coming to work there? I told him no, you're out of your mind, brother. I mean, I live an hour and a half away. That's three hours driving, not going to happen. Man said it went well. He asked me would I consider it for a job? I said no, man, that's crazy man, I'm not driving on this. And then my wife said, well, that's kind of selfish of you. And so for like two or three days now it was in my brain. You know, now I'm really feeling God, you know, telling me if you want me to stay and I'll tell you if I want to stay. And he, you know, he told me, you know I want you to stay and three months, it was some crazy stuff. He told me take care of it. I said yeah, but don't throw me in on the bus if I take care of it. You know, so slowly I just you know, we just started looking for the diamonds in the rough in the residence and so I started mentoring the residents and started hiring them. And if you go to Teen Challenge New Jersey today, absolutely every single employee is an ex-resident from that program. Wow, that's amazing. Everyone, for the exception of myself, every employee. The assistant director, dave Dave, was there as an alcoholic. He, you know, it's 88 acre campus. Unless your man there, you can leave whenever you want. Well, he decided to leave. He went into the forest, you know, and we went looking for him. We found him laying down making him leave. He came back Today's. The assistant director that's awesome. You know, absolutely every single employee in Teen Challenge New Jersey is a former resident there. 35:58 For me, it's probably one of the best ministries I've ever been in, because one of the things that bother me in the ministry is not seeing a lot of fruit of your labor. Okay, in Teen Challenge you see it every day. Every day you see guys walk in that I have EMT on standby. He looks like he's gonna die any second and a year later he's just a totally different man On fire for God. 36:29 I started Six months ago. I started six months ago. I started every other month a family worship night where I invite different pastors to come worship group and I bring their families in this way, when they go home they go the family, they know the Lord, and so you know I'm the pastor, but really I've been the ghost director for six years. If I were to leave today, I know I did my job, I left it well. I left it well and so I love challenges. You know I like people telling me you can't do that. Yeah, you know, but if God says, yeah, you can do it, I want you to do it, I'll go for it. Being in Teen Challenge has been a joy for me. It's been a joy to be there, a joy to work with these men, a joy to mentor these guys. I had Vernon, which was a resident that became assistant director. I married him. You know it's just a joy to do that and that God would use me that way. It's just I love it. 37:43 - Speaker 3 I mean, you talk about Robbie Cano. You alluded to him before you lived in Staten Island. The Staten Island Yankee team is on Staten Island and when he was on the minor league contract, before he got that big $300 million deal or whatever he was over the house. 37:58 - Speaker 1 Yeah, well, when Canito, I call him Canito, yeah, thank you for clarifying that for our audience. 38:04 - Speaker 3 Robinson Cano is. 38:05 - Speaker 1 Canito. He's Canito and he called me Tio, which is uncle Right Right. So he was a standout Yankee. He was like 17, 18 years old and a lot of the Hispanic players. They don't have money, you know, they pay very little. They have to pay for their room and board and really what a lot of those guys get to eat is the food from the stadium hot dogs and hamburgers. So I would invite a lot of the Hispanic guys over and have pork chops and rice and beans and tancocho and all the food that we love, you know, and so Canito would. He would be the first one to come, you know, and so he made it. 38:40 Well, first, when he made it, they get like a petty cash. Okay, when you're in the minor league, you may get, you know, $34. Major league, you get, you know, a couple of hundred, depending on who you are, maybe a couple of thousand. So Luis Soho gave me an envelope and he opened it. He sold like 500 bucks. He said, oh, luis, you gave me the wrong envelope. And Luis smacked him in the face with it, told him you're in the Major League now, and so when I went to spring training when he first made it, I took a roll of paper and I threw it at his feet and he said what's that? That's your bill, brother. All the rice and beans you ate in my house, you make a million. 39:16 - Speaker 2 Now Brother needs to get paid, you know you know, you know Kano. 39:22 - Speaker 1 He's a good kid man. You know he making bad decisions. You know that's why he got suspended, but he's really a decent guy. You know people really never talk about the good. A lot of guys you guys do, you know a lot of them do a lot of good. Alex Rodriguez has given so much St Jude Boys Club, sure Just, and he's really got a great heart, you know. 39:49 - Speaker 3 Every time you had Mariano Carlos Beltran come to an event I was doing a fundraising event and they would come they usually wrote the biggest check in the room. Forget about an appearance fee. They always waive that but they were the first one and I always thought to myself you know, these guys are making millions and millions of dollars. You never had your hand in their pocket. You never had your that level of integrity. The same level of integrity that says I'll drive an hour and a half each way not to stay at the player's hotel because my integrity matters. You know, you can lose that reputation. You can lose that integrity in a moment. 40:29 - Speaker 1 A lot of people don't understand that. You know, they get caught up in the fame. My boss, george McGovern, when I started doing this he used to say to me never make it yours Okay, never make it yours Okay. He said it to a point of annoyance, to where I would see him and go across the street because he would say it and I was already pissed about it. But I'm so grateful he did, because I was able to walk away from all these teams because it was never mine, right, it was God's, it was God. 40:58 During COVID you really couldn't see them. You had a sky, you know. And that's where I felt you know, this is it. And then the thing with Teen Challenge came about and I felt God take over there. But I never asked these guys for money, never asked for money In the Nets. I was able to go to one guy to get two tickets for every game. Never went to him Because if I wanted tickets I knew how to get them. I mean, how many times did you come to the Nets game? Yeah, what kind of seats did we sit in? Behind the bench, did I ask anyone? No, no, I used the ushers. I used to minister to them. You know how many ushers came to me that had issues with their kid and I helped them. 41:36 - Speaker 3 I remember going to the games and one of the ushers saying Chapman, well, you know, and no matter who was from the traveling secretary to people up in C-suite, you know boxes and VIPs that were working for the teams. Every one of them respected you because of your integrity. 41:52 - Speaker 1 It's my church, that's the way I saw it. You know, the Yankee Stadium, the IZOT Center, the Prudential Center, you know Brooklyn Center, that was my church, man. And so the ushers, the people that dealt with the food, you know, I just ministered to them, man, you know, and it wasn't with a 50-pound Bible, damning them to hell because that crap doesn't work. Yes, it doesn't work, man. Chances are the only Jesus that people are going to see is the Jesus in you. Yes, it's the Jesus in you. 42:22 One of the things that was very effective to me was the guys knowing that I was married and how faithful I was to my wife. They knew how faithful I was. I traveled with the Nets, with Byron six years, went to two championships with them, and I would get to the hotel, go up to the room and never came down, never came down. You know, even one time I came down because I needed some drink and there was nothing to drink in the refrigerator. I came down and when I was coming back up there was a player in the elevator with a young lady and that wasn't his wife. Okay, and I go. I know his wife and my wife PC. People don't know that Nancy, my wife did chapel with the Yankees for 18 years with the wives and the girlfriends, and she did it with the Nets, and he looked at him and I nodded my head. Next day I'm watching him looking. I know he's looking for me, you know, and so I kind of let him fry a little bit, you know, didn't? 43:19 - Speaker 2 go to him right away, you know. 43:20 - Speaker 1 And he said oh Pastor, what do you got? Second Listen man last night, I'm not the morality police brother. 43:27 God didn't send me to monitor your morality, but if you want me to help you work through this, I'll do that. He said let's do that. I won't mention his name, but today he broadcasts this for a major NBA team. He's one of the most golliest boy you could find. He has several kids in a good marriage. We stay connected all the time. 43:52 I had the same number for 30 years. I can't change it. I like to change it because people call me with some wacky stuff, man, but I can't because I'll get a player I haven't spoke to in seven years and he falls into an issue. He'll call me hey, Pastor, what do you? Got a minute? Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna lack the man. Can you come down here? Yeah, fly me down, brother, I'll be there. Okay, my girl, hook it up. I'll fly the lantern. I say that could happen a couple months ago. I'm there and I spend a day, two days, with him talking it through it, you know, and, and Tell him you got to connect yourself to a church man, you got to stay accountable, you know, and I help him do that. And but it's crazy, you know that I even do that. You know, it's wild man. 44:46 - Speaker 3 Like I said, I've had a front row seat to watch all of it for the last 20 years. 44:50 - Speaker 4 Well, so you said, you know, some things just don't work being the morality police, it just doesn't work it doesn't work. There's a lot of stuff that churches do that just doesn't work, and you're not afraid to call it out. But yeah, and this is why I felt like your book was about the church. But yet you see the beauty, you love the church and you say in your book there are more good churches and good pastors by far. 45:13 - Speaker 1 But if you leave, don't gossip. If you leave, don't tear somebody up, man, you know, don't do that. Don't do that, because if you do that it's not honoring God, it's not honoring God's way and it's only going to hurt you. It's not going to hurt them, man, it's going to hurt you, it's going to hurt. You're kind of taking God's hand off, you, you know. And so that's the last thing I want to do, right, because I'm a dangerous dude without God's hand on me. You know, the old Willie is constantly trying to come up, constantly trying to come up, and I got to constantly keep him in check. You know, and you see, people think you come to the Lord and you're okay, and I'm okay, and we all hold hands and sing kumbaya, bull, crap, okay, we all struggle with something. Some of us more than one, like me, more than one, okay, and we come to the Lord with this luggage and we need to open up that suitcase and start getting rid of some of that stuff. Some of us don't, so we want to walk with God with that stuff, I know, you know, when I own my home, I make sure that my lawn was beautiful. I'm kind of an anal guy, you know, and just because I lived in a cardboard box doesn't mean I'm not clean, you know. And so I like my lawn nice, but now and then a little dandelion will pop up, you know, and I take it out and it will come back up. And so I googled it, you know, and they said you got to get to the root, right, and there's this little contraption that you buy for $19.99 and you bring it down and you twist it and you got the root. See, that's what some Christians have to do. They got to get to the root of that issue, right, and you got to be in God's word every single day. 47:07 I have a routine. I get up at four o'clock in the morning every day, take my shower, brush my teeth you know, brother's clean. I go to the kitchen, I get a Nutella because I'm Puerto Rican, that's what we drink and I sit down and I have my one-year Bible. This is probably the 22nd year I'm doing it. I do my one-year Bible. I have my devotion. No, back up. 47:31 Before I do any of that, I sit on my sofa and I keep quiet for half an hour. I want to hear God. I want to hear God man, I tell God, god, I'm so stupid sometimes, god man, because it's a journey, you know, and the OU country is trying to pop up. You got to learn how to keep it up, but you got to be in God's word every day. You know whether it's Psalms 119, that word I've hid in my heart. I'm not sitting against God, you know. So when I'm going to this, you know, a verse pops up on me Sure, it's my lifesaver right. 48:05 And I think a lot of Christians are pulpit Christians. All they know is what they hear from the pulpit. That's all they know. They have no time in God's word. They have no time quiet with God. They don't do a devotion. They don't come to prayer meeting, they don't come to none of that. All they do is they show up on a Sunday, they give their 10% and they think they got it. They don't know what to do. You do not get to it. God wants you to get to it alone. God put people in your life to help you get there. You know, they just do. 48:39 You know one of the things that I really, really learned. You know, I'm a Puerto Rican that grew up during the Civil Rights era. I remember two faucets. I remember my mother. There were the Woolworths on Broadway in Granham and I remember my mother saying we can't eat here. I remember those things. So I grew up with a sense of not liking white people, you know. 49:03 But in my walk with God, some of the people that helped me the most have been white folks. You know, like John Urban, that has helped me immensely, helped me the most have been my folks. You know, like John Urban, that is just helped me immensely, helped me raise money. He you know Urban Impact. He gave us millions of dollars. You know a guy like Bob Benson owns the biggest insurance company in Austin. I'm retired now. Just come alongside of me, you know Even allowed me to stay in this condo in Florida. You know, just, you know. And condo in Florida, you know, just you know. And I've learned, you know, to be colorblind to when it comes to the things of God, you know so. So it's been a journey in many, many, many ways. 49:42 - Speaker 4 Wow, amen. Well, thank you again, pastor Willie. This has been an amazing conversation. I can't wait to share it with our community. Really, really appreciate it. Well, thank you, man and and. 49:51 - Speaker 1 I can't wait to share it with our community. I really, really appreciate it. Well, thank you, man, and you know, for the audience, listen, I got the shot to be, so I'm going to take advantage of it. Right, if you want me to come to your church and speak, just you know, Google my name, pastor Willie Alfonso, and I'll have my information and we'll go from there. 50:07 - Speaker 3 Yeah, so we got the new book on the other side of fear by Willie Alfonso. The forward is by Mariano Rivera and if they want to find out more information we'll put it in the link, but it's walfonzoministriescom. 50:21 - Speaker 1 W-A-L-F-O-N-S. No O at the end at AOLcom, at. 50:26 - Speaker 3 AOLcom and I will tell you, as somebody that's had Chaplain Willie preach for me in many an event, many a pulpit, if you want somebody who's going to be real and authentic in your pulpit, in your church as a church leader speaking in your nonprofit or in your ministry center, you want to make sure you get to Chaplain Willie Alfonso. This has been Faithly Stories. Alicia Lee, ceo and founder. Chaplain Willie Alfonso, pastor Adam Durso here. God bless you. 50:52 - Speaker 1 Thank you. 50:54 - Speaker 2 Thank you for tuning in to the Faithly Stories podcast. We pray this episode gave you the encouragement you needed to continue on your journey. The Faithly Stories podcast is brought to you by Faithly, an online community committed to empowering church leaders, pastors, staff and volunteers. Committed to empowering church leaders, pastors, staff and volunteers. The Faithly Digital Platform offers innovative and practical tools and resources to enhance connection, foster collaboration and promote growth within the church and ministry space. Remember to subscribe, rate and review our podcast to help reach more listeners like you. Stay tuned for more uplifting tales from the front lines of ministry on the Faithly podcast. Stay bold, stay faithful and never underestimate the power of your own story.