Special 1: The Imperfect CEO - Garry Ridge | Faithly Podcast

100:00:00.460 --> 00:00:03.580When you're the hero, that's what your people200:00:03.580 --> 00:00:08.120need, but you quietly become the ceiling of300:00:08.120 --> 00:00:08.860the organization.400:00:09.060 --> 00:00:12.240It's not because you're failing, but it's because500:00:12.240 --> 00:00:13.740you're trying to be flawless.600:00:21.220 --> 00:00:24.260Welcome to the Imperfect CEO, a special series700:00:24.260 --> 00:00:26.860by the Faithly Podcast with your host, Reverend800:00:26.860 --> 00:00:29.140Adam Durso and author Jim Brown.900:00:31.540 --> 00:00:34.420Welcome to another episode of Faithly Podcast.1000:00:34.420 --> 00:00:37.420My name is Pastor Adam Durso and I1100:00:37.420 --> 00:00:39.360am the host of today's episode.1200:00:39.360 --> 00:00:41.980And I get the incredible honor and privilege1300:00:41.980 --> 00:00:44.940to sit here and talk with two esteemed1400:00:44.940 --> 00:00:48.920leaders that are doing incredible things currently and1500:00:48.920 --> 00:00:53.880had an incredible history of leading organizations, author1600:00:53.880 --> 00:00:56.980Jim Brown, who has the brand new book,1700:00:57.080 --> 00:01:00.100The Imperfect CEO, I am joined by you,1800:01:00.180 --> 00:01:01.520my friend, why don't you give a greetings1900:01:01.520 --> 00:01:02.600to the audience?2000:01:03.220 --> 00:01:05.680So good to be connected with all of2100:01:05.680 --> 00:01:07.900you and looking forward to the conversation that2200:01:07.900 --> 00:01:10.600we're going to have today, I'm excited about2300:01:10.600 --> 00:01:13.680what the new book is going to do2400:01:13.680 --> 00:01:17.040out in the marketplace and I'm excited because2500:01:17.040 --> 00:01:20.060it's just one book in many that are2600:01:20.060 --> 00:01:24.040now emerging that are making everyone pay more2700:01:24.040 --> 00:01:26.700attention to the culture and the leadership of2800:01:26.700 --> 00:01:30.740companies, Garry Ridge, who I'm excited to be2900:01:30.740 --> 00:01:34.680joining our, our conversation has also written a3000:01:34.680 --> 00:01:37.080great book on this very same topic.3100:01:37.140 --> 00:01:40.460Indeed, I would say, Garry, you've been way3200:01:40.460 --> 00:01:43.660ahead of your time for decades as you've3300:01:43.660 --> 00:01:47.180been a champion of culture and, and the,3400:01:47.280 --> 00:01:48.940and the type of leadership that we're talking3500:01:48.940 --> 00:01:53.500about, um, at WD 40 company, um, your3600:01:53.500 --> 00:01:55.860new book, the any dumb ass can do3700:01:55.860 --> 00:01:56.040it.3800:01:56.140 --> 00:01:57.940I like how you say it, that it's3900:01:57.940 --> 00:01:59.800the sort of thing that you don't have4000:01:59.800 --> 00:02:00.820to be brilliant.4100:02:01.400 --> 00:02:02.760A donkey could do this.4200:02:03.000 --> 00:02:05.140If you just go through the right steps4300:02:05.140 --> 00:02:06.240and have the right mindset.4400:02:06.600 --> 00:02:08.000So welcome Garry.4500:02:08.759 --> 00:02:08.979Yeah.4600:02:09.080 --> 00:02:09.880Good day, Jim.4700:02:09.979 --> 00:02:10.720And good day, Adam.4800:02:10.800 --> 00:02:11.520Great to be with you.4900:02:11.580 --> 00:02:12.400Thank you so much.5000:02:12.500 --> 00:02:14.680Uh, I am the Dean of dumb assery5100:02:14.680 --> 00:02:16.340and it's a pleasure to be with you5200:02:16.340 --> 00:02:16.660today.5300:02:16.820 --> 00:02:19.160And you know, as you just mentioned, my5400:02:19.160 --> 00:02:20.880new book, any dumb ass can do it.5500:02:20.880 --> 00:02:23.080The word I SS is not referring to5600:02:23.080 --> 00:02:24.740anybody's bottom or posterior.5700:02:25.140 --> 00:02:28.140Uh, it's really talking about a donkey and5800:02:28.140 --> 00:02:30.480you know, donkeys get a bad rap.5900:02:30.560 --> 00:02:32.720People think they're just stubborn or slow, but6000:02:32.720 --> 00:02:33.960let me tell you the truth.6100:02:34.100 --> 00:02:35.100Donkeys are steady.6200:02:35.300 --> 00:02:37.980They'll keep going long after others give up6300:02:37.980 --> 00:02:39.400their loyal companions.6400:02:39.580 --> 00:02:41.120You can count on them when the road6500:02:41.120 --> 00:02:45.400gets rough, they protect and they're calm, watchful,6600:02:45.420 --> 00:02:47.420and surprisingly brave.6700:02:47.420 --> 00:02:50.620When it matters, they're practical, not flashy.6800:02:50.880 --> 00:02:53.120They know how to conserve energy and get6900:02:53.120 --> 00:02:53.780the job done.7000:02:53.940 --> 00:02:56.080And while they might not always rush into7100:02:56.080 --> 00:02:57.920things that caution.7200:02:58.320 --> 00:02:59.900Uh, keeps them safe.7300:03:00.080 --> 00:03:02.220So when I say any dumb ass can7400:03:02.220 --> 00:03:04.160do it, what I really mean is you7500:03:04.160 --> 00:03:05.400don't have to be brilliant to be a7600:03:05.400 --> 00:03:05.900great leader.7700:03:06.060 --> 00:03:07.800You just need a bit of courage, a7800:03:07.800 --> 00:03:10.400lot of care, and the humility to keep7900:03:10.400 --> 00:03:13.980learning because like the donkey leadership isn't about8000:03:13.980 --> 00:03:14.760showing off.8100:03:14.840 --> 00:03:17.820It's about carrying the load, sticking with the8200:03:17.820 --> 00:03:20.160journey and helping others get to where they8300:03:20.160 --> 00:03:20.760need to go.8400:03:21.700 --> 00:03:25.580Garry, um, uh, you led the WD 408500:03:25.580 --> 00:03:26.520company.8600:03:26.680 --> 00:03:28.060Could you give the audience that may not8700:03:28.060 --> 00:03:29.900be as familiar with you a little bit8800:03:29.900 --> 00:03:30.900of your history and a little bit of8900:03:30.900 --> 00:03:33.160your journey, maybe a peek behind the curtain9000:03:33.160 --> 00:03:35.860into your leadership that now is producing this9100:03:35.860 --> 00:03:36.200new book?9200:03:36.960 --> 00:03:37.320Yeah, sure.9300:03:37.420 --> 00:03:37.700Thanks.9400:03:37.980 --> 00:03:38.880Thanks for the question, Adam.9500:03:39.000 --> 00:03:41.180Yeah, I was with WD 40 for 359600:03:41.180 --> 00:03:41.700years.9700:03:42.000 --> 00:03:44.560I started in Australia in 1987.9800:03:44.560 --> 00:03:47.640I opened the Australian subsidiary in 1994.9900:03:47.640 --> 00:03:49.800I was invited to move to the United10000:03:49.800 --> 00:03:53.200States to head up our international expansion program.10100:03:53.200 --> 00:03:56.620And then in 1997, the then CEO retired.10200:03:56.900 --> 00:03:59.520So for my sins, I got to be10300:03:59.520 --> 00:04:00.020CEO.10400:04:01.220 --> 00:04:03.720Um, and, uh, that was an amazing journey,10500:04:03.840 --> 00:04:06.520but the real turning point was in 1999,10600:04:06.520 --> 00:04:10.240two years into being CEO, I went back10700:04:10.240 --> 00:04:10.760to school.10800:04:10.800 --> 00:04:12.940I did a master's degree in leadership at10900:04:12.940 --> 00:04:14.540the university of San Diego.11000:04:15.260 --> 00:04:17.600And that's where I met my dear, dear11100:04:17.600 --> 00:04:20.600friend and my mentor, Dr. Ken Blanchard, the11200:04:20.600 --> 00:04:21.460one minute manager.11300:04:21.900 --> 00:04:25.280And that two year master's program was one11400:04:25.280 --> 00:04:28.160where I was exposed to the, the real11500:04:28.160 --> 00:04:31.580benefit of servant leadership, you know, leaders are11600:04:31.580 --> 00:04:33.480there to serve those they have the privilege11700:04:33.480 --> 00:04:34.160to lead.11800:04:34.280 --> 00:04:37.060And I took the elements of that learning11900:04:37.060 --> 00:04:39.600and implemented it in the company within the12000:04:39.600 --> 00:04:40.020company.12100:04:40.020 --> 00:04:42.740And, uh, I love that program so much.12200:04:42.740 --> 00:04:45.000We ended up sending about 30 people over12300:04:45.000 --> 00:04:47.18025 years through that same program.12400:04:47.480 --> 00:04:49.720And it was that turning point.12500:04:50.100 --> 00:04:52.780That really, uh, made a difference.12600:04:53.220 --> 00:04:55.840Um, in the first chapter of my book,12700:04:55.860 --> 00:04:58.300I talk about kind of an aha moment12800:04:58.300 --> 00:04:58.820I had.12900:04:58.900 --> 00:05:01.220I was on a flight from Los Angeles13000:05:01.220 --> 00:05:04.480to Sydney and, uh, I was 38,00013100:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.840feet above the South Pacific ocean 2 AM13200:05:06.840 --> 00:05:08.740in the morning, and as you do, you13300:05:08.740 --> 00:05:09.860take stuff to read.13400:05:09.920 --> 00:05:11.800And I'd read a quote that's attributed to13500:05:11.800 --> 00:05:12.700the Dalai Lama.13600:05:12.960 --> 00:05:14.800And it was our purpose in life is13700:05:14.800 --> 00:05:15.880to make people happy.13800:05:15.980 --> 00:05:17.380If we can't make them happy, at least13900:05:17.380 --> 00:05:18.180don't hurt them.14000:05:18.360 --> 00:05:20.880And I thought, what a wonderful, wonderful objective14100:05:20.880 --> 00:05:22.600to have if you're leading a company.14200:05:22.740 --> 00:05:24.940And then pretty soon after I read another14300:05:24.940 --> 00:05:26.900quote, uh, from Aristotle.14400:05:27.680 --> 00:05:30.080And it said, uh, pleasure in the job14500:05:30.080 --> 00:05:31.560puts perfection in the work.14600:05:31.580 --> 00:05:33.840And I thought, my goodness, if we had14700:05:33.840 --> 00:05:35.620a place where we were really wanting to14800:05:35.620 --> 00:05:37.280help people, or they enjoyed what they were14900:05:37.280 --> 00:05:39.300doing, we would be able to build a15000:05:39.300 --> 00:05:41.860company that was enduring over time.15100:05:41.880 --> 00:05:43.360I didn't know how to do it.15200:05:43.600 --> 00:05:45.800And that's when I went back to school15300:05:45.800 --> 00:05:47.540and I learned some of those elements.15400:05:47.540 --> 00:05:49.900So then for 25 years, I was CEO15500:05:49.900 --> 00:05:51.380and chairman of the board eventually.15600:05:51.380 --> 00:05:54.460And I refired three years ago.15700:05:55.160 --> 00:05:56.340Um, not retired.15800:05:56.340 --> 00:05:58.240And my purpose now is I hope to15900:05:58.240 --> 00:06:01.820build cultures of belonging where love, forgiveness, and16000:06:01.820 --> 00:06:04.420learning inspire a happier, more connected world, because16100:06:04.420 --> 00:06:06.680we need a happier, more connected world.16200:06:07.640 --> 00:06:09.340Jim, it seems like there's a lot of16300:06:09.340 --> 00:06:12.200overlap between what Garry is sharing and what16400:06:12.200 --> 00:06:16.120you call the imperfect leadership movement, uh, talk16500:06:16.120 --> 00:06:17.800a little bit about what that means and16600:06:17.800 --> 00:06:20.680maybe draw some correlations to what Garry just16700:06:20.680 --> 00:06:20.960shared.16800:06:21.780 --> 00:06:22.020Sure.16900:06:22.360 --> 00:06:25.820Uh, it's my observation is that most leaders17000:06:25.820 --> 00:06:27.980in the corporate world, especially, but it's not17100:06:27.980 --> 00:06:30.420only that it's, it's really leadership in all17200:06:30.420 --> 00:06:30.920circles.17300:06:31.600 --> 00:06:36.160Have this sense of pressure, uh, of responsibility17400:06:36.160 --> 00:06:38.160to show up like they've got all the17500:06:38.160 --> 00:06:38.640answers.17600:06:38.940 --> 00:06:40.500They know exactly what to do.17700:06:40.580 --> 00:06:43.500They're very confident and they end up carrying17800:06:43.500 --> 00:06:47.480all this weight on their shoulders, what Garry17900:06:47.480 --> 00:06:51.440just described, the idea of make people happy18000:06:51.440 --> 00:06:53.500and at least don't cause any harm.18100:06:53.880 --> 00:06:59.460That is so counter corporate culture that, well,18200:06:59.500 --> 00:07:00.400it's just refreshing.18300:07:00.920 --> 00:07:05.500Because most, uh, MBA programs would be teaching18400:07:05.500 --> 00:07:07.880people that no, it's, it's about the numbers.18500:07:07.960 --> 00:07:11.300You have to push, push, push, maximize performance,18600:07:11.780 --> 00:07:15.700optimize outcome, uh, increased share value.18700:07:17.460 --> 00:07:20.860That, that language isn't in anything that Garry18800:07:20.860 --> 00:07:25.380said and what, what he somehow understood all18900:07:25.380 --> 00:07:29.300those years ago was if we really lead19000:07:29.300 --> 00:07:33.700people so that they enjoy their lives and19100:07:33.700 --> 00:07:35.540they can be their best, they can be,19200:07:35.640 --> 00:07:39.020that will make the company prosperous, uh, and19300:07:39.020 --> 00:07:40.820it will make everybody happier.19400:07:41.280 --> 00:07:42.600It's all, it's all good.19500:07:43.800 --> 00:07:47.120As imperfect leaders, we need to just relax19600:07:47.120 --> 00:07:49.880and remember we are imperfect.19700:07:50.240 --> 00:07:50.940Everyone is.19800:07:51.620 --> 00:07:53.560And if, if we're going to be our19900:07:53.560 --> 00:07:56.560best, we need to just own our, our20000:07:56.560 --> 00:08:01.160reality, uh, be authentic more than ever today.20100:08:01.700 --> 00:08:06.700People expect their leaders to show up as20200:08:06.700 --> 00:08:07.220humans.20300:08:07.460 --> 00:08:12.380And, um, Garry did that back in 1999.20400:08:13.140 --> 00:08:15.300The idea that we're just catching up to20500:08:15.300 --> 00:08:17.360him is a little bit humbling for, for20600:08:17.360 --> 00:08:17.980most of us.20700:08:18.440 --> 00:08:21.260Uh, so that's why this conversation is going20800:08:21.260 --> 00:08:22.080to be so much fun.20900:08:22.800 --> 00:08:25.000Garry's the guy that's been doing it and21000:08:25.000 --> 00:08:27.420we're going to learn why he's been doing21100:08:27.420 --> 00:08:29.420it and the impact, because if it didn't21200:08:29.420 --> 00:08:31.600work, he would have done something different by,21300:08:32.100 --> 00:08:34.559you know, by 10 years in, uh, no,21400:08:34.679 --> 00:08:36.620it, the truth is it really did work.21500:08:37.100 --> 00:08:40.539Garry's company has prospered remarkably and people have21600:08:40.539 --> 00:08:42.919loved working for WD-40 company.21700:08:43.820 --> 00:08:44.340Yeah.21800:08:44.400 --> 00:08:46.400I mean, Garry, when Jim talks about your21900:08:46.400 --> 00:08:49.560leadership and the culture that you both created22000:08:49.560 --> 00:08:53.200and sustained, he, I quote, created a learning22100:08:53.200 --> 00:08:53.760culture.22200:08:53.880 --> 00:08:55.240What does, what does that mean, Garry, when22300:08:55.240 --> 00:08:58.380you're instituting that in, in, in an organization22400:08:58.380 --> 00:08:59.020or a company?22500:09:00.020 --> 00:09:02.760Well, one of the biggest disablers people have22600:09:02.760 --> 00:09:03.740in life is fear.22700:09:04.760 --> 00:09:07.500And, um, you know, if you think about22800:09:07.500 --> 00:09:10.120it, I don't remember seeing many people running22900:09:10.120 --> 00:09:12.780down corridors, yelling out, I'm a failure, I23000:09:12.780 --> 00:09:13.220failed.23100:09:13.760 --> 00:09:16.460But, you know, we have this low psychological23200:09:16.460 --> 00:09:19.280safety in organizations where people are afraid.23300:09:19.480 --> 00:09:21.740So what I said is let's turn failure23400:09:21.740 --> 00:09:22.500into learning.23500:09:22.620 --> 00:09:24.720So we developed something called the learning moment.23600:09:25.220 --> 00:09:27.540And we said that we don't make mistakes.23700:09:27.680 --> 00:09:28.680We have learning moments.23800:09:28.920 --> 00:09:31.000And the definition of a learning moment is23900:09:31.000 --> 00:09:33.780a positive or negative outcome of any situation24000:09:33.780 --> 00:09:36.440that needs to be openly and freely shared24100:09:36.440 --> 00:09:37.540to benefit all people.24200:09:37.620 --> 00:09:41.140So if we learned something that was really,24300:09:41.380 --> 00:09:43.000really powerful, let's share it.24400:09:43.120 --> 00:09:45.040And if we learned something that was powerful,24500:09:45.060 --> 00:09:47.020but it didn't quite turn out the way24600:09:47.020 --> 00:09:48.980we wanted, let's share that also.24700:09:49.140 --> 00:09:51.820So we save those around us from having24800:09:51.820 --> 00:09:52.880the same learning moment.24900:09:52.880 --> 00:09:54.300But I just want to go back to25000:09:54.300 --> 00:09:58.060something Jim said, Jim, I think performance in25100:09:58.060 --> 00:10:00.220an organization is really important.25200:10:00.220 --> 00:10:01.680And what I don't want people to walk25300:10:01.680 --> 00:10:03.940away with today is this is the soft25400:10:03.940 --> 00:10:04.460stuff.25500:10:04.540 --> 00:10:04.820Yeah.25600:10:04.920 --> 00:10:07.840This, what we're talking about is the hard25700:10:07.840 --> 00:10:08.460stuff.25800:10:08.540 --> 00:10:12.140If it was easy, we wouldn't have 7025900:10:12.140 --> 00:10:14.340% of people going to work every day26000:10:14.340 --> 00:10:17.880in the United States today, disengaged or actively26100:10:17.880 --> 00:10:18.720disengaged.26200:10:18.720 --> 00:10:22.040So my theory was if you have a26300:10:22.040 --> 00:10:25.700reasonably good strategy and you have a high26400:10:25.700 --> 00:10:29.100percentage of your people fully engaged, going to26500:10:29.100 --> 00:10:32.380work every day, the will of the people,26600:10:32.440 --> 00:10:35.260as I call it, time strategy equals the26700:10:35.260 --> 00:10:35.760outcome.26800:10:36.220 --> 00:10:39.440So good strategy, 80% of your people26900:10:39.440 --> 00:10:42.820go to work every day because they're motivated27000:10:42.820 --> 00:10:45.700and passionate because they know and feel like27100:10:45.700 --> 00:10:46.340they belong.27200:10:46.340 --> 00:10:49.300They know that the work they do matters27300:10:49.300 --> 00:10:50.520and makes a difference.27400:10:50.680 --> 00:10:53.460There's a high degree of psychological safety because27500:10:53.460 --> 00:10:56.820learning is at the core, not failure, and27600:10:56.820 --> 00:10:59.460there's a set of values that protect them27700:10:59.460 --> 00:10:59.880free.27800:11:00.160 --> 00:11:03.420And their leaders are acting as coaches, not27900:11:03.420 --> 00:11:03.940managers.28000:11:04.400 --> 00:11:06.460You're going to get a much better result.28100:11:06.860 --> 00:11:09.260Then if 30% of your people are28200:11:09.260 --> 00:11:12.100going to work every day, it's very simple.28300:11:12.180 --> 00:11:14.380And that's why I don't understand why some28400:11:14.380 --> 00:11:15.260leaders don't get it.28500:11:15.260 --> 00:11:19.640This is, this is an odd high will28600:11:19.640 --> 00:11:23.300of the people, reasonable strategy, great outcome, low28700:11:23.300 --> 00:11:26.180will of the people, reasonable strategy, not a28800:11:26.180 --> 00:11:26.820great outcome.28900:11:28.700 --> 00:11:30.740The math is, uh, unavoidable.29000:11:30.980 --> 00:11:35.540And, and yet there's something in the system,29100:11:35.560 --> 00:11:42.620in the whole management leadership training agenda that29200:11:42.620 --> 00:11:46.460has been going on for decades, that, that29300:11:46.460 --> 00:11:49.320has set us up for failure for disappointment.29400:11:50.920 --> 00:11:52.120What is that?29500:11:52.360 --> 00:11:54.520Garry's holding up a character here.29600:11:55.000 --> 00:11:55.960What do you got there, Garry?29700:11:56.160 --> 00:11:57.600This is this, this is what's in the29800:11:57.600 --> 00:11:58.000system.29900:11:58.180 --> 00:12:00.940This is Alec, or it could be Alice,30000:12:01.320 --> 00:12:07.240the soul sucking CEO of fear incorporated and30100:12:07.240 --> 00:12:11.180Alec or Alice have some leadership attributes that30200:12:11.180 --> 00:12:12.000create this.30300:12:12.300 --> 00:12:14.280Number one is they have a big ego.30400:12:14.340 --> 00:12:17.020Their ego eats their empathy instead of their30500:12:17.020 --> 00:12:18.720empathy, eating their ego.30600:12:18.880 --> 00:12:20.700They're a micromanager.30700:12:20.920 --> 00:12:22.800They want to have their fingers in everything.30800:12:23.000 --> 00:12:24.520They're corporate royalty.30900:12:24.700 --> 00:12:26.720They think they're an entitled leader.31000:12:27.080 --> 00:12:29.900I've spent my life climbing this corporate ladder.31100:12:30.000 --> 00:12:32.060Those shall bring the coffee to my desk.31200:12:32.200 --> 00:12:34.040If you can unlock the door.31300:12:34.460 --> 00:12:36.160They love a fear-based culture.31400:12:36.160 --> 00:12:37.960They're a master of control.31500:12:38.420 --> 00:12:40.400Now, what you touched on, Jim, they're a31600:12:40.400 --> 00:12:40.840know it all.31700:12:40.940 --> 00:12:43.460They have all the answers, even the wrong31800:12:43.460 --> 00:12:43.980ones.31900:12:44.160 --> 00:12:46.160They don't value learning.32000:12:46.420 --> 00:12:48.140They must always be right.32100:12:48.440 --> 00:12:51.440They hate feedback and they avoid accountability and32200:12:51.440 --> 00:12:53.200they blame others and they don't keep their32300:12:53.200 --> 00:12:53.580commitments.32400:12:54.240 --> 00:12:58.420That's the problem versus the servant leader and32500:12:58.420 --> 00:13:00.920the servant leader loves and involves their people.32600:13:00.920 --> 00:13:04.300Always in servant leadership mode is expected to32700:13:04.300 --> 00:13:06.160be competent and they love learning.32800:13:06.740 --> 00:13:07.980They're very connected.32900:13:08.100 --> 00:13:09.580They spend a lot of time in what33000:13:09.580 --> 00:13:11.480I call the stinky locker room of the33100:13:11.480 --> 00:13:13.900business instead of some corporate tower.33200:13:14.220 --> 00:13:15.960They have a heart of gold, but they33300:13:15.960 --> 00:13:17.440also have a backbone of steel.33400:13:17.820 --> 00:13:19.340They're champions of hope.33500:13:19.620 --> 00:13:22.080They know micromanagement is not scalable.33600:13:22.340 --> 00:13:24.300They do what they say they're going to33700:13:24.300 --> 00:13:26.340do and they treasure the gift of feedback.33800:13:26.620 --> 00:13:27.640That's the difference.33900:13:29.180 --> 00:13:30.400Can I ask you a question, Garry?34000:13:30.980 --> 00:13:32.920When you talk about, you know, this isn't34100:13:32.920 --> 00:13:33.720just the soft stuff.34200:13:34.020 --> 00:13:37.140What was, what was the most interesting or34300:13:37.140 --> 00:13:40.720the most difficult learning moment you had to34400:13:40.720 --> 00:13:43.680navigate or that wasn't a failure, but it34500:13:43.680 --> 00:13:45.940was definitely a learning moment for somebody that34600:13:45.940 --> 00:13:47.440was working for you at WD40?34700:13:48.720 --> 00:13:52.180Um, I think there's many, um, personally, it34800:13:52.180 --> 00:13:54.180was getting very comfortable with the most, the34900:13:54.180 --> 00:13:56.080three most powerful words I've ever learned in35000:13:56.080 --> 00:13:56.560my life.35100:13:56.740 --> 00:13:58.100I don't know.35200:14:00.100 --> 00:14:03.360I don't know when I first went on,35300:14:03.500 --> 00:14:04.640you know, went back to school.35400:14:04.760 --> 00:14:06.360I did a disc profile and I was35500:14:06.360 --> 00:14:09.400a turbo D and the definition of a35600:14:09.400 --> 00:14:11.460turbo D is be brief, be bright, be35700:14:11.460 --> 00:14:11.820gone.35800:14:12.540 --> 00:14:14.820And that was when I found out what35900:14:14.820 --> 00:14:16.760I was, I realized what I didn't want36000:14:16.760 --> 00:14:17.180to be.36100:14:17.580 --> 00:14:20.860And I think intentionalism around leadership is so36200:14:20.860 --> 00:14:21.360important.36300:14:21.940 --> 00:14:24.140So, you know, I have people ask this36400:14:24.140 --> 00:14:26.920question, am I being the person I want36500:14:26.920 --> 00:14:27.960to be right now?36600:14:28.360 --> 00:14:29.680And who is that person?36700:14:30.340 --> 00:14:32.080And can you list who you want to36800:14:32.080 --> 00:14:32.280be?36900:14:32.340 --> 00:14:33.840I have a little notebook that I carry37000:14:33.840 --> 00:14:34.140around.37100:14:34.240 --> 00:14:35.740I have a little placard on it and37200:14:35.740 --> 00:14:37.240it says, am I being the person I37300:14:37.240 --> 00:14:38.200want to be right now?37400:14:38.340 --> 00:14:39.620And then who is that person?37500:14:39.980 --> 00:14:42.100And I have a list of things intentionally37600:14:42.100 --> 00:14:43.360that I want to be aware of.37700:14:43.360 --> 00:14:44.140I want to be grateful.37800:14:44.180 --> 00:14:45.080I want to be caring.37900:14:45.220 --> 00:14:46.380I want to be empathetic.38000:14:46.380 --> 00:14:47.340I want to be reasonable.38100:14:47.340 --> 00:14:48.340I want to be a listener.38200:14:48.500 --> 00:14:49.900I want to be fact-based.38300:14:49.940 --> 00:14:51.420I want to have a balanced opinion.38400:14:51.600 --> 00:14:52.640I want to be curious.38500:14:52.760 --> 00:14:54.120I want to be a learner and I38600:14:54.120 --> 00:14:55.740want to throw sunshine, not a shadow.38700:14:55.740 --> 00:14:58.980I have to remind myself of that because38800:14:58.980 --> 00:15:01.040the world will want me to be something38900:15:01.040 --> 00:15:01.380different.39000:15:01.420 --> 00:15:03.740Particularly if you're the CEO of a public39100:15:03.740 --> 00:15:06.820company, you know, they will, they will want39200:15:06.820 --> 00:15:08.240you not to be who you want to39300:15:08.240 --> 00:15:10.000be and we have no right to take39400:15:10.000 --> 00:15:11.440our leftovers to anybody.39500:15:11.580 --> 00:15:13.100We need to take our full self.39600:15:16.220 --> 00:15:16.320Wow.39700:15:16.460 --> 00:15:21.500Jim, when you think about leadership accountability and39800:15:21.500 --> 00:15:23.620yet you've got to balance it with a39900:15:23.620 --> 00:15:28.980learning culture and Fawcett, especially amongst senior leaders,40000:15:29.460 --> 00:15:32.360what does that look like in through the40100:15:32.360 --> 00:15:33.620lens of the imperfect CEO?40200:15:35.000 --> 00:15:38.780Yeah, Adam's referring to one of the peaks40300:15:38.780 --> 00:15:42.000that we have in our ascent model, leadership40400:15:42.000 --> 00:15:42.560accountability.40500:15:42.560 --> 00:15:46.760The idea that all the leaders are accountable40600:15:46.760 --> 00:15:50.000first to each other and then to the40700:15:50.000 --> 00:15:54.020entire company about the impact they have on40800:15:54.020 --> 00:15:57.620people, about their actions, their behaviors, not just40900:15:57.620 --> 00:15:59.000the results that they're getting.41000:15:59.080 --> 00:16:03.260Of course that matters, but most companies are41100:16:03.260 --> 00:16:10.220way more preoccupied with outcomes and under, uh,41200:16:10.220 --> 00:16:12.860they, they pay too little attention to the41300:16:12.860 --> 00:16:14.740behaviors that contribute.41400:16:15.340 --> 00:16:22.220So an accountable leadership team actually behaves in41500:16:22.220 --> 00:16:23.800the ways that Garry was describing.41600:16:24.320 --> 00:16:25.940They use that word.41700:16:26.040 --> 00:16:28.080I don't know that, that those three powerful41800:16:28.080 --> 00:16:28.520words.41900:16:28.720 --> 00:16:31.960I don't know, without feeling like that makes42000:16:31.960 --> 00:16:33.720them disqualified to be a leader.42100:16:33.960 --> 00:16:35.900No, it, it just makes them human.42200:16:36.620 --> 00:16:39.880And as long as they are going to42300:16:39.880 --> 00:16:41.820work together to either find the person in42400:16:41.820 --> 00:16:45.160the room that has the answer or find42500:16:45.160 --> 00:16:47.540a plan between them to go and get42600:16:47.540 --> 00:16:50.740the answer, it's all workable, we don't have42700:16:50.740 --> 00:16:52.400to have the answer like that.42800:16:52.640 --> 00:16:55.140And as Garry said, it's even worse if42900:16:55.140 --> 00:16:57.380you've got an answer and you spouted off43000:16:57.380 --> 00:16:58.980with confidence and it's wrong.43100:16:59.600 --> 00:16:59.880Wow.43200:17:00.000 --> 00:17:01.560Now we're really messing things up.43300:17:03.060 --> 00:17:07.880Leadership accountability is the humility to say, I'm43400:17:07.880 --> 00:17:08.599not perfect.43500:17:09.430 --> 00:17:12.380I need people around me because they bring43600:17:12.380 --> 00:17:13.880strengths that I don't have.43700:17:14.560 --> 00:17:17.460I'm going to bring my best to the43800:17:17.460 --> 00:17:20.400whole equation, but I'm not enough.43900:17:20.780 --> 00:17:22.060I can't be.44000:17:22.880 --> 00:17:28.180So the power of teamwork and then multiply44100:17:28.180 --> 00:17:31.160that by a hundred, a thousand, 10,00044200:17:31.160 --> 00:17:35.020people in the company team, we can change44300:17:35.020 --> 00:17:35.640the world.44400:17:36.600 --> 00:17:39.280The thing that scares me, Adam, is how44500:17:39.280 --> 00:17:44.820many of those leaders go home exhausted because44600:17:44.820 --> 00:17:48.960they've been pretending to be almost perfect every44700:17:48.960 --> 00:17:49.380day.44800:17:50.400 --> 00:17:53.320They're, they don't have the energy to be44900:17:53.320 --> 00:17:54.820their best at home anymore.45000:17:55.540 --> 00:17:58.940Um, they feel like they're always on, even45100:17:58.940 --> 00:18:00.800when they're at home, that they're, they don't45200:18:00.800 --> 00:18:01.940really have rest.45300:18:02.940 --> 00:18:06.000It makes me think of a client story.45400:18:06.140 --> 00:18:09.060I'm thinking of a fellow who was the45500:18:09.060 --> 00:18:11.180CEO, founder of a company.45600:18:12.060 --> 00:18:15.620He was very visionary, timeless.45700:18:16.260 --> 00:18:18.800And from the outside, it kind of looked45800:18:18.800 --> 00:18:21.280like that meant the company got momentum.45900:18:22.040 --> 00:18:26.100But inside it was just pressure because every46000:18:26.100 --> 00:18:27.980decision bottlenecked at him.46100:18:28.540 --> 00:18:31.640People waited instead of leading themselves.46200:18:34.160 --> 00:18:37.520One night he said something that betrayed his46300:18:37.520 --> 00:18:37.880problem.46400:18:38.240 --> 00:18:41.780He said, I don't trust anyone else to46500:18:41.780 --> 00:18:44.340carry this, but I'm tired of carrying it46600:18:44.340 --> 00:18:44.820alone.46700:18:47.070 --> 00:18:48.090See, that's the trap.46800:18:48.670 --> 00:18:52.370When you're the hero, that's what your people46900:18:52.370 --> 00:18:56.910need, but you quietly become the ceiling of47000:18:56.910 --> 00:18:57.630the organization.47100:18:57.870 --> 00:19:01.030It's not because you're failing, but it's because47200:19:01.030 --> 00:19:02.530you're trying to be flawless.47300:19:04.470 --> 00:19:08.930Most CEOs don't, don't need more motivation.47400:19:09.490 --> 00:19:11.750What they need is permission to just lead47500:19:11.750 --> 00:19:12.210differently.47600:19:12.490 --> 00:19:16.310And, and Garry's example, I hope will give47700:19:16.310 --> 00:19:18.730more leaders listening right now today.47800:19:19.350 --> 00:19:22.130That permission to realize, no, I don't have47900:19:22.130 --> 00:19:24.390to do it the way that somehow I48000:19:24.390 --> 00:19:27.450was told I can do this differently.48100:19:28.430 --> 00:19:32.410You know, when I was CEO and I48200:19:32.410 --> 00:19:34.810used to introduce myself, good day, I'm Garry48300:19:34.810 --> 00:19:39.830Ridge, I'm the consciously incompetent, probably wrong and48400:19:39.830 --> 00:19:40.770roughly right.48500:19:41.170 --> 00:19:43.710Chairman of C and CEO of WD 4048600:19:43.710 --> 00:19:44.210company.48700:19:44.350 --> 00:19:45.610And I need all the help I can48800:19:45.610 --> 00:19:45.910get.48900:19:46.270 --> 00:19:48.250And it's amazing how much help you get.49000:19:48.450 --> 00:19:50.950And that's the way, and I, I'd often49100:19:50.950 --> 00:19:52.750say I'm probably wrong and roughly right.49200:19:52.990 --> 00:19:54.990I'm don't, you know, I'm never a hundred49300:19:54.990 --> 00:19:57.210percent wrong and I'm never well, I probably49400:19:57.210 --> 00:19:58.230was a hundred percent wrong.49500:20:00.590 --> 00:20:03.250Garry, when you're in a learning culture, you're,49600:20:03.290 --> 00:20:06.730you're creating this and there's obviously a, a,49700:20:06.730 --> 00:20:10.130a need for accountability, especially as you get49800:20:10.130 --> 00:20:13.510closer to senior levels of leadership, how do49900:20:13.510 --> 00:20:18.290you discern and differentiate between impact and intentions?50000:20:20.850 --> 00:20:26.050Um, well, I think firstly around accountability, are50100:20:26.050 --> 00:20:28.330we clear about what we're holding ourselves accountable50200:20:28.330 --> 00:20:28.750for?50300:20:28.870 --> 00:20:30.830And I think clarity is so important.50400:20:31.050 --> 00:20:32.390What do you expect from me?50500:20:33.190 --> 00:20:34.570When do you expect that?50600:20:34.610 --> 00:20:36.830And to what standard do I might to50700:20:36.830 --> 00:20:37.430deliver it?50800:20:37.570 --> 00:20:39.830And I wrote a book with Ken Blanchard50900:20:39.830 --> 00:20:41.690called helping people win at work.51000:20:41.890 --> 00:20:43.750And the byline is I'm not here to51100:20:43.750 --> 00:20:44.530Mark your paper.51200:20:44.530 --> 00:20:45.750I'm here to help you get an eye.51300:20:46.410 --> 00:20:48.970So the next question is, do people know51400:20:48.970 --> 00:20:50.370what that eye looks like?51500:20:50.450 --> 00:20:52.210If an eye walked in the room today,51600:20:52.350 --> 00:20:53.970what would it look like?51700:20:54.030 --> 00:20:57.890Then our job as leaders and coaches, not51800:20:57.890 --> 00:21:00.010managers, because I really don't like the word51900:21:00.010 --> 00:21:00.510manager.52000:21:00.630 --> 00:21:03.550You manage your bank account and you manage52100:21:03.550 --> 00:21:04.190inventory.52200:21:04.190 --> 00:21:05.730You don't manage people.52300:21:05.810 --> 00:21:07.150Your job is to coach them.52400:21:07.330 --> 00:21:09.950So your job is to help those.52500:21:09.970 --> 00:21:12.010You have the privilege to lead and coach,52600:21:12.450 --> 00:21:13.690get the best outcome.52700:21:13.690 --> 00:21:16.430So a great coach is committed to helping52800:21:16.430 --> 00:21:17.530a player get an eye.52900:21:18.450 --> 00:21:20.990Importantly, they're brave enough to put the players53000:21:20.990 --> 00:21:24.250growth ahead of their own comfort.53100:21:24.650 --> 00:21:27.910They know the game, they know the standards53200:21:27.910 --> 00:21:30.170and what winning really looks like.53300:21:30.590 --> 00:21:34.290They stay on the sideline, resisting the urge53400:21:34.290 --> 00:21:36.330to jump in and take over.53500:21:36.730 --> 00:21:41.570They observe first, listen deeply and watch how53600:21:41.570 --> 00:21:43.150the play unfolds.53700:21:43.690 --> 00:21:47.470They add value through timely, honest feedback that53800:21:47.470 --> 00:21:50.010helps the player improve the next play.53900:21:50.510 --> 00:21:53.510They expect the player to apply the coaching54000:21:53.510 --> 00:21:54.210received.54100:21:54.630 --> 00:21:58.170They never seek the podium or credit for54200:21:58.170 --> 00:21:58.630the win.54300:21:59.210 --> 00:22:01.210And they invest time in what I call54400:22:01.210 --> 00:22:05.250the stinky locker room, building trust, safety, and54500:22:05.250 --> 00:22:06.630belief in the organization.54600:22:07.610 --> 00:22:10.030So I think there's two things.54700:22:10.310 --> 00:22:10.850Is it clear?54800:22:10.850 --> 00:22:12.830And then what are you doing to keep54900:22:12.830 --> 00:22:14.490people on that track to win the best55000:22:14.490 --> 00:22:14.790game?55100:22:16.730 --> 00:22:20.710Jim, in your book, the imperfect CEO, uh,55200:22:20.710 --> 00:22:24.170you give a formula for success.55300:22:24.550 --> 00:22:28.410Uh, culture times strategy equals outcomes.55400:22:28.450 --> 00:22:30.030Can you break that down a little bit?55500:22:30.290 --> 00:22:31.410No, that's not my formula.55600:22:31.530 --> 00:22:32.570That's Garry's formula.55700:22:32.750 --> 00:22:33.870That's Garry's formula.55800:22:34.010 --> 00:22:34.770Garry's formula.55900:22:34.830 --> 00:22:37.010How has in my book, because he told56000:22:37.010 --> 00:22:39.710me that wonderful formula and I love it.56100:22:39.710 --> 00:22:40.910And that's fantastic.56200:22:40.910 --> 00:22:42.530So Jim elaborate on that.56300:22:42.670 --> 00:22:47.370How has Garry's formula impact your leadership?56400:22:47.650 --> 00:22:49.770How you coach confession.56500:22:49.850 --> 00:22:50.750Yeah, go ahead.56600:22:50.870 --> 00:22:54.230I stole the formula from Simon Sinek.56700:22:54.410 --> 00:22:55.270Oh, beautiful.56800:22:55.570 --> 00:22:58.310In Simon's book, he said culture equals values56900:22:58.310 --> 00:22:59.110plus behavior.57000:22:59.150 --> 00:23:01.990And I said to Simon, Simon, you forgot57100:23:01.990 --> 00:23:03.270a word consistency.57200:23:03.290 --> 00:23:06.450So now culture equals values plus behavior times57300:23:06.450 --> 00:23:07.050consistency.57400:23:07.050 --> 00:23:10.950So this, this formula has been ginned up57500:23:10.950 --> 00:23:11.630by a lot of people.57600:23:12.230 --> 00:23:14.190Well, I'm just loving the honesty on here57700:23:14.190 --> 00:23:16.210because most podcasts, somebody would have just said,57800:23:16.270 --> 00:23:16.830ah, that's me.57900:23:16.910 --> 00:23:18.610And the bottom line is we're all giving58000:23:18.610 --> 00:23:20.430credit to somebody else with the same exact58100:23:20.430 --> 00:23:20.710quote.58200:23:20.970 --> 00:23:24.250So Jim, you read it and got it58300:23:24.250 --> 00:23:26.390from Garry, but it's had an impact.58400:23:26.450 --> 00:23:28.210It's, it shaped the way you do some58500:23:28.210 --> 00:23:30.910of your leadership coaching and those kinds of58600:23:30.910 --> 00:23:31.010things.58700:23:31.210 --> 00:23:33.470Speak to that, even how it's impacted your58800:23:33.470 --> 00:23:36.070writing in the imperfect CEO and the imperfect58900:23:36.070 --> 00:23:38.130CEO leadership movement.59000:23:38.930 --> 00:23:39.030Yeah.59100:23:39.330 --> 00:23:43.010So again, the, the old model of leadership59200:23:43.010 --> 00:23:45.830has been so focused on strategy.59300:23:45.830 --> 00:23:47.530Like if we just get the right strategy,59400:23:47.530 --> 00:23:49.310we're going to win the world.59500:23:49.830 --> 00:23:54.550And there's been very little attention to culture.59600:23:54.970 --> 00:24:00.470What I love about that formula, not, let59700:24:00.470 --> 00:24:02.390me just, let me just also say, I59800:24:02.390 --> 00:24:05.170love that we stand on the shoulders of59900:24:05.170 --> 00:24:06.570the people that go before us.60000:24:06.690 --> 00:24:08.390I'm standing on Garry's shoulders.60100:24:08.770 --> 00:24:11.150Um, Garry's standing on Simon's shoulders.60200:24:11.390 --> 00:24:12.890It's not about age.60300:24:12.970 --> 00:24:15.730It's about who, who came up with something60400:24:15.730 --> 00:24:17.790that's working and lets us win.60500:24:17.930 --> 00:24:19.610Well, let's, let's all take it on.60600:24:19.710 --> 00:24:22.270And I know Garry isn't trying to own60700:24:22.270 --> 00:24:22.470it.60800:24:22.850 --> 00:24:25.850He would, he would like me wish that60900:24:25.850 --> 00:24:30.030every CEO would grasp this and make it61000:24:30.030 --> 00:24:33.670their own, because if we don't make culture61100:24:33.670 --> 00:24:38.690a central piece of how we aim for61200:24:38.690 --> 00:24:41.710our companies to be successful, we're just going61300:24:41.710 --> 00:24:43.610to be going in circles.61400:24:43.810 --> 00:24:45.930It's, it's the math that Garry shared earlier.61500:24:46.430 --> 00:24:49.150If, if 70% of our people are61600:24:49.150 --> 00:24:52.290disengaged because they don't feel valued, they're not61700:24:52.290 --> 00:24:54.250sure that their strengths matter.61800:24:54.490 --> 00:24:56.410They don't even know if the job they're61900:24:56.410 --> 00:24:58.170doing makes a difference in the world.62000:24:59.050 --> 00:25:01.430Then it doesn't matter how much effort they62100:25:01.430 --> 00:25:04.970put in because it's not taking them forward.62200:25:05.090 --> 00:25:06.970It doesn't matter how good the strategy is62300:25:06.970 --> 00:25:09.330because they're not bringing their best.62400:25:09.510 --> 00:25:12.150When they see something that is probably going62500:25:12.150 --> 00:25:14.850to be a problem, they don't say it.62600:25:15.930 --> 00:25:18.170Adam, you may remember one of the, the62700:25:18.170 --> 00:25:20.630terrible client stories that I shared in my62800:25:20.630 --> 00:25:25.030book was about, uh, a leader who instructed62900:25:25.030 --> 00:25:28.730someone to put certain chemicals in a big63000:25:28.730 --> 00:25:29.570storage tank.63100:25:30.110 --> 00:25:32.750And it was the guy that did it63200:25:32.750 --> 00:25:36.030knew it would destroy everything in that tank,63300:25:36.510 --> 00:25:39.850but he quote, followed the direction of the63400:25:39.850 --> 00:25:42.630leader because it wasn't safe for him to63500:25:42.630 --> 00:25:43.590challenge the leader.63600:25:44.050 --> 00:25:46.190And it costs millions of dollars.63700:25:46.910 --> 00:25:49.150These kinds of things are happening in companies63800:25:49.150 --> 00:25:50.490all around the world.63900:25:51.950 --> 00:25:54.050Imagine what is possible.64000:25:54.190 --> 00:25:57.910Imagine the level of prosperity and impact in64100:25:57.910 --> 00:25:58.330the world.64200:25:58.350 --> 00:25:59.030That's possible.64300:25:59.350 --> 00:26:02.630If we actually valued people so that they64400:26:02.630 --> 00:26:04.710could be the best that they can be.64500:26:05.010 --> 00:26:08.170And that all contributes to the impact of64600:26:08.170 --> 00:26:08.670the company.64700:26:09.290 --> 00:26:10.290Yeah, definitely.64800:26:10.450 --> 00:26:12.630You know, we had 98% of the64900:26:12.630 --> 00:26:14.830people at the company globally said they love65000:26:14.830 --> 00:26:16.610to tell people they worked at the company.65100:26:16.730 --> 00:26:20.070We had a 93% employee engagement, 9765200:26:20.070 --> 00:26:22.410% of our people said they respected their65300:26:22.410 --> 00:26:22.830coach.65400:26:22.830 --> 00:26:24.830It was their quote unquote manager.65500:26:24.970 --> 00:26:27.510Most people leave organizations because they hate their65600:26:27.510 --> 00:26:27.930boss.65700:26:29.110 --> 00:26:31.010And by the way, we had a compounded65800:26:31.010 --> 00:26:33.290annual growth rate, a total shareholder return of65900:26:33.290 --> 00:26:35.01015% a year, and their value of66000:26:35.010 --> 00:26:37.310the company went from 300 million to over66100:26:37.310 --> 00:26:37.890$3 billion.66200:26:39.190 --> 00:26:42.450So, you know, again, we proved that you66300:26:42.450 --> 00:26:44.870can, and our strategy was a reasonable strategy,66400:26:45.070 --> 00:26:49.850but the multiplier was the culture, um, because66500:26:49.850 --> 00:26:51.950people, you know, I often say, imagine a66600:26:51.950 --> 00:26:53.570place where you go to work every day,66700:26:53.590 --> 00:26:55.670you make a contribution to something bigger than66800:26:55.670 --> 00:26:56.130yourself.66900:26:56.330 --> 00:26:59.930You learn something new, you're protected and you're67000:26:59.930 --> 00:27:02.990set free by a compelling set of values67100:27:02.990 --> 00:27:06.930and you go home happy, happy people build67200:27:06.930 --> 00:27:10.990happy families, happy families, build happy communities, happy67300:27:10.990 --> 00:27:12.750communities, build a happy world.67400:27:12.750 --> 00:27:14.450We need a happy world.67500:27:14.530 --> 00:27:17.750Business has a responsibility and an opportunity to67600:27:17.750 --> 00:27:20.310make a positive difference in this unhappy world67700:27:20.310 --> 00:27:22.570that we're kind of having to deal with67800:27:22.570 --> 00:27:25.870right now, if we just send people home67900:27:25.870 --> 00:27:28.330happy, because they felt like they belong, they68000:27:28.330 --> 00:27:29.890mattered, the things that I've shared.68100:27:30.250 --> 00:27:31.730So, you know, to me, it's like, Oh,68200:27:31.790 --> 00:27:32.050duh.68300:27:33.940 --> 00:27:37.160Um, so you, you, you said you referenced68400:27:37.160 --> 00:27:39.300this before, Garry, you said, you know, to68500:27:39.300 --> 00:27:41.140the people that think this is just the68600:27:41.140 --> 00:27:44.360soft stuff, the, the people that think this68700:27:44.360 --> 00:27:48.700is just, um, fluff, there's really a direct68800:27:48.700 --> 00:27:52.660correlation between the health of the organization and68900:27:52.660 --> 00:27:53.440the bottom line.69000:27:54.660 --> 00:27:55.240Absolutely.69100:27:56.260 --> 00:28:00.420And, and Jim, so when you're coaching, uh,69200:28:00.480 --> 00:28:03.220organizations and you're helping to, to, to lead69300:28:03.220 --> 00:28:07.420this movement, how are you, uh, positioning or69400:28:07.420 --> 00:28:11.540describing the correlation so that that leader understands,69500:28:11.680 --> 00:28:15.540yes, you're accountable for, um, the, the growth69600:28:15.540 --> 00:28:16.440of your organization.69700:28:16.660 --> 00:28:16.840Yes.69800:28:16.860 --> 00:28:19.740The bottom line, but there is something in69900:28:19.740 --> 00:28:22.040this and what we're talking about that has70000:28:22.040 --> 00:28:26.640a direct impact on your success as a70100:28:26.640 --> 00:28:29.120leader, as a CEO, et cetera.70200:28:31.320 --> 00:28:33.970One of the most surprising problems that I70300:28:33.970 --> 00:28:36.890observe as I work with leadership teams of70400:28:36.890 --> 00:28:40.710companies, whether there's 200 people in the company70500:28:40.710 --> 00:28:43.870or 20,000 people in the company is70600:28:43.870 --> 00:28:48.750how tempted these leaders are to try to70700:28:48.750 --> 00:28:53.390become recognized as heroes, and they do that70800:28:53.390 --> 00:28:59.490by focusing on outcomes and their, their doing70900:28:59.490 --> 00:29:03.190rather than their leading and what leadership is71000:29:03.190 --> 00:29:06.790supposed to be about is serving, I even71100:29:06.790 --> 00:29:10.850use the word loving people so that they71200:29:10.850 --> 00:29:11.750can be their best.71300:29:12.410 --> 00:29:15.410Again, if I've got 200 people in my71400:29:15.410 --> 00:29:18.690company, it doesn't matter how many hours I71500:29:18.690 --> 00:29:20.490work and how hard I work or how71600:29:20.490 --> 00:29:23.430smart I am, I could never be as.71700:29:24.970 --> 00:29:30.050Impactful, resourceful, fruitful as 200 people.71800:29:30.250 --> 00:29:34.350My job is to make it easy for71900:29:34.350 --> 00:29:36.830those 200 people to be the best they72000:29:36.830 --> 00:29:37.290can be.72100:29:37.450 --> 00:29:39.430That's where results come.72200:29:40.050 --> 00:29:42.150That's where multiplication comes.72300:29:42.530 --> 00:29:46.410So the CFO, and I've seen this over72400:29:46.410 --> 00:29:50.130and over, who is looking over the shoulders72500:29:50.130 --> 00:29:53.970of someone on their finance team, who's entering72600:29:53.970 --> 00:29:56.650numbers into a spreadsheet and the CFO just72700:29:56.650 --> 00:30:00.170can't stand it, says, wait and pushes their72800:30:00.170 --> 00:30:02.030chair out of the way and type something72900:30:02.030 --> 00:30:05.870into the spreadsheet themselves, they've just told that73000:30:05.870 --> 00:30:08.630person on the team, you're not really that73100:30:08.630 --> 00:30:11.650good, I'm way better than you are, uh,73200:30:11.690 --> 00:30:15.490you shouldn't really even worry about it, I've73300:30:15.490 --> 00:30:15.990got it.73400:30:15.990 --> 00:30:20.190Well, those, those people go home and they73500:30:20.190 --> 00:30:22.190wonder if it's worth coming the next day.73600:30:22.730 --> 00:30:22.830Right.73700:30:23.330 --> 00:30:24.630But they need to pay their mortgage.73800:30:24.770 --> 00:30:26.430So they come, they show up, they get73900:30:26.430 --> 00:30:29.490paid, but they don't bring their best.74000:30:29.830 --> 00:30:32.290They just show up and punch the clock.74100:30:33.470 --> 00:30:38.070Leadership is about making it so people, and74200:30:38.070 --> 00:30:41.090I, sometimes I say this and people think74300:30:41.090 --> 00:30:44.550I'm imagining crazy, impossible things.74400:30:44.550 --> 00:30:48.790People like their job so much, they're, they74500:30:48.790 --> 00:30:50.570can't wait to get there the next day74600:30:50.570 --> 00:30:54.790because they believe that it is the expression74700:30:54.790 --> 00:30:56.730of what they were made to be.74800:30:56.850 --> 00:30:59.770It is the opportunity for them to bring74900:30:59.770 --> 00:31:04.030their, their gifts, their strengths, and do something75000:31:04.030 --> 00:31:05.330that matters in the world.75100:31:05.510 --> 00:31:08.390And better than that, they're surrounded by people75200:31:08.390 --> 00:31:10.230who are doing the same and all of75300:31:10.230 --> 00:31:12.470that comes together and we're a part of75400:31:12.470 --> 00:31:14.670something that's way bigger than I could ever75500:31:14.670 --> 00:31:18.630be again, Garry, please help the leaders who75600:31:18.630 --> 00:31:20.990are listening, who are scared that that is75700:31:20.990 --> 00:31:24.310pie in the sky, help them hear how75800:31:24.310 --> 00:31:27.410you saw that happening at WD-40 company.75900:31:28.130 --> 00:31:31.990Yeah, we saw it happening because firstly, you76000:31:31.990 --> 00:31:34.210know, we wanted a place where people escape76100:31:34.210 --> 00:31:35.610to not escape from.76200:31:36.990 --> 00:31:38.950And I wrote about that in my book76300:31:38.950 --> 00:31:42.570is that, you know, many people would say76400:31:42.570 --> 00:31:44.690to us, I want to be here because76500:31:44.690 --> 00:31:47.470I feel valued and maybe they weren't valued76600:31:47.470 --> 00:31:49.830in their personal life, but you know, there's76700:31:49.830 --> 00:31:52.330four, four pillars that I talk about that76800:31:52.330 --> 00:31:56.850are in place, their care, candor, accountability, and76900:31:56.850 --> 00:31:57.490responsibility.77000:31:57.970 --> 00:32:00.510So pillar one is we love, and I77100:32:00.510 --> 00:32:02.310use the word love, we love and care77200:32:02.310 --> 00:32:05.410about our people enough, not only to reward77300:32:05.410 --> 00:32:08.830and applaud them for doing great work, but77400:32:08.830 --> 00:32:11.650we're brave enough to redirect them when they're77500:32:11.650 --> 00:32:14.770not playing for an A, not protecting our77600:32:14.770 --> 00:32:17.030own comfort zone at the expense of someone77700:32:17.030 --> 00:32:17.750else's growth.77800:32:18.030 --> 00:32:20.730And, you know, people want to be directed77900:32:20.730 --> 00:32:21.530to play well.78000:32:22.070 --> 00:32:24.630Candor is no lying, no faking, no hiding.78100:32:25.050 --> 00:32:28.450I believe most people don't lie in organizations,78200:32:28.450 --> 00:32:29.790they fake and hide.78300:32:30.030 --> 00:32:31.550Why do they fake and hide?78400:32:31.550 --> 00:32:33.970Because of fear, because you've got, you know,78500:32:33.970 --> 00:32:36.770Alec or Alice, the soul sucking CEO who78600:32:36.770 --> 00:32:38.970can never be challenged and doesn't want to78700:32:38.970 --> 00:32:42.790hear another opinion, accountability, are we clear?78800:32:42.910 --> 00:32:44.550What do I expect from you?78900:32:44.730 --> 00:32:46.670What do you expect from me?79000:32:47.130 --> 00:32:49.330And how do we bring those two together?79100:32:49.330 --> 00:32:53.870And then finally responsibility, you know, responsibility equals79200:32:53.870 --> 00:32:55.270accountability and ownership.79300:32:55.270 --> 00:32:56.950And in fact, we had something and they79400:32:56.950 --> 00:32:58.670still have it at WD-40 company.79500:32:58.810 --> 00:33:01.750And I call it the vaccination against the79600:33:01.750 --> 00:33:04.030nah, nah, nah, nah, nah disease, as I79700:33:04.030 --> 00:33:06.170called it, the finger pointing disease.79800:33:06.550 --> 00:33:08.350And we call it the maniac pledge.79900:33:09.250 --> 00:33:12.230And it says, I am responsible for taking80000:33:12.230 --> 00:33:16.730action, asking questions, getting answers and making decisions.80100:33:17.310 --> 00:33:19.650I won't wait for someone to tell me80200:33:19.650 --> 00:33:21.930if I need to know I am responsible80300:33:21.930 --> 00:33:22.830for asking.80400:33:23.230 --> 00:33:25.430I have no right to be offended that80500:33:25.430 --> 00:33:26.730I didn't get this sooner.80600:33:27.010 --> 00:33:29.310And if I'm doing something others should know80700:33:29.310 --> 00:33:31.630about, I am responsible for telling them.80800:33:32.270 --> 00:33:33.990So those are the things that you put,80900:33:34.050 --> 00:33:37.350you put permissions in place in organizations that81000:33:37.350 --> 00:33:39.970allow people to be who they need to81100:33:39.970 --> 00:33:40.250be.81200:33:41.090 --> 00:33:44.030Jim, we've talked a lot about the senior81300:33:44.030 --> 00:33:47.970leader, the imperfect CEO and their impact on81400:33:47.970 --> 00:33:50.530subordinates or impact on the people working for81500:33:50.530 --> 00:33:53.270them, them potentially not bringing their full self81600:33:53.270 --> 00:33:56.590to the table, them being miserable or and81700:33:56.590 --> 00:33:58.390so as a result, not being as productive.81800:33:58.390 --> 00:34:01.630But the people that might be watching or81900:34:01.630 --> 00:34:05.870listening to this podcast, who are CEOs, who82000:34:05.870 --> 00:34:08.870are in top tier senior leadership level positions,82100:34:08.870 --> 00:34:13.090who are just exhausted and tired of trying82200:34:13.090 --> 00:34:16.989to hold everything together and pretend like they've82300:34:16.989 --> 00:34:18.230got all the answers.82400:34:18.969 --> 00:34:20.190What do you say to them?82500:34:20.310 --> 00:34:23.929And and what what would you help them82600:34:23.929 --> 00:34:25.590to be able to take away from this82700:34:25.590 --> 00:34:29.870podcast and really adopt into their learning?82800:34:30.290 --> 00:34:31.889I know, I know you've worked on this.82900:34:31.969 --> 00:34:33.690You've got something special for some of those83000:34:33.690 --> 00:34:35.690leaders who are even listening right now.83100:34:36.830 --> 00:34:37.090Exactly.83200:34:38.810 --> 00:34:41.790What I do with my my private consulting83300:34:41.790 --> 00:34:45.370clients is talk through the kinds of impacts83400:34:45.370 --> 00:34:49.449that they're having, that they're the the choices,83500:34:49.650 --> 00:34:53.370their behaviors that they're exhibiting or having on83600:34:53.370 --> 00:34:57.470people and help them recognize that all of83700:34:57.470 --> 00:35:00.190that can change if they make some changes.83800:35:00.450 --> 00:35:03.410See, it turns out that in most cases,83900:35:03.890 --> 00:35:07.050the the limiting factor of an organization's growth84000:35:07.050 --> 00:35:08.350is the leader.84100:35:08.630 --> 00:35:13.250And if they would kick the ceiling and84200:35:13.250 --> 00:35:15.550and push up, everything gets better.84300:35:16.150 --> 00:35:19.430I have something that I called the imperfect84400:35:19.430 --> 00:35:20.650manifesto.84500:35:21.150 --> 00:35:23.790So I have these conversations with these leaders84600:35:23.790 --> 00:35:26.490and then I share this document that just84700:35:26.490 --> 00:35:28.270kind of wraps it all together.84800:35:28.790 --> 00:35:31.030It's, I don't know, eight or 10 pages.84900:35:31.170 --> 00:35:32.050It's not a huge thing.85000:35:32.990 --> 00:35:35.390As we're listening today, I'm conscious that there85100:35:35.390 --> 00:35:38.910are people who are wondering to themselves, oh,85200:35:39.050 --> 00:35:41.650might they be the limiting factor in their85300:35:41.650 --> 00:35:42.410organization?85400:35:42.410 --> 00:35:45.910And as much as I want them to85500:35:45.910 --> 00:35:47.670read Garry's book, I want them to read85600:35:47.670 --> 00:35:48.230my book.85700:35:49.030 --> 00:35:51.450These people need something right away.85800:35:51.810 --> 00:35:54.490So what I would like to encourage them85900:35:54.490 --> 00:35:56.210to do is to find me on LinkedIn86000:35:56.210 --> 00:35:59.510at author Jim Brown.86100:35:59.830 --> 00:36:01.370That's that's my handle.86200:36:02.550 --> 00:36:06.750And DM me the word private P-R86300:36:06.750 --> 00:36:08.310-I-V-A-T-E.86400:36:08.870 --> 00:36:12.690I'll send that manifesto to them so that86500:36:12.690 --> 00:36:15.130they can just get a quick tool to86600:36:15.130 --> 00:36:17.570actually make a difference right away.86700:36:17.630 --> 00:36:20.090Something practical to work with immediately.86800:36:20.630 --> 00:36:24.870Again, at author Jim Brown on LinkedIn, uh,86900:36:24.890 --> 00:36:26.850and send me the word private.87000:36:27.870 --> 00:36:31.150And you'll personally send the imperfect manifesto to87100:36:31.150 --> 00:36:32.210them for free?87200:36:32.890 --> 00:36:33.890Absolutely free.87300:36:34.150 --> 00:36:34.330Absolutely.87400:36:34.350 --> 00:36:35.170To help them right now.87500:36:35.350 --> 00:36:35.870I just want it to be better.87600:36:36.090 --> 00:36:36.230Yeah.87700:36:36.230 --> 00:36:38.370This is just normally reserved for your private87800:36:38.370 --> 00:36:40.310clients, but you're doing this for free to87900:36:40.310 --> 00:36:41.950help these CEOs and leaders.88000:36:42.090 --> 00:36:44.710And then the book is, uh, the imperfect88100:36:44.710 --> 00:36:50.350CEO book.com imperfect book CEO, imperfect CEO88200:36:50.350 --> 00:36:51.150book.com.88300:36:51.250 --> 00:36:51.790I'm sorry, Jim.88400:36:52.030 --> 00:36:52.690I messed that up.88500:36:52.690 --> 00:36:53.390Go to that site.88600:36:53.490 --> 00:36:53.690Yes.88700:36:53.750 --> 00:36:54.890There's, there's a package.88800:36:54.990 --> 00:36:57.630There's several packages for them to, to buy88900:36:57.630 --> 00:37:01.830bulk orders, uh, before the release, imperfect CEO89000:37:01.830 --> 00:37:02.990book.com.89100:37:02.990 --> 00:37:06.450And there's incredible bonuses that we've provided.89200:37:06.670 --> 00:37:09.930So that, uh, as for example, if, if89300:37:09.930 --> 00:37:12.570people say, yeah, I'll get 10 books so89400:37:12.570 --> 00:37:14.730that the people closest to me each get89500:37:14.730 --> 00:37:18.410a copy, um, that's $500, but they ended89600:37:18.410 --> 00:37:22.210up getting like $3,000 worth of bonuses.89700:37:22.710 --> 00:37:25.190Uh, it, it, it comes back to what89800:37:25.190 --> 00:37:26.030you've been saying, Garry.89900:37:26.050 --> 00:37:27.370It's like a, uh, duh.90000:37:27.550 --> 00:37:29.350Uh, how, how does that not make sense?90100:37:29.350 --> 00:37:32.630But my encouragement is that people would order90200:37:32.630 --> 00:37:34.470books, but like I said, if you want90300:37:34.470 --> 00:37:37.810something right away, send, send me that message90400:37:37.810 --> 00:37:39.950and we'll get you a resource immediately.90500:37:40.710 --> 00:37:43.370At author, Jim Brown on LinkedIn and just90600:37:43.370 --> 00:37:45.970send the word private and we'll get that90700:37:45.970 --> 00:37:48.710imperfect manifesto out to you, Garry, to those,90800:37:48.770 --> 00:37:50.570to those CEOs and leaders that I just90900:37:50.570 --> 00:37:53.870described and Jim just addressed, what would be91000:37:53.870 --> 00:37:57.430your closing thought to them that are struggling,91100:37:57.430 --> 00:37:59.190that have to feel like they've got to91200:37:59.190 --> 00:38:01.530put up this facade, this front that says,91300:38:01.750 --> 00:38:02.410I know it all.91400:38:02.410 --> 00:38:05.130And it really has become the limiter and91500:38:05.130 --> 00:38:06.770the lid to their organization.91600:38:07.070 --> 00:38:08.830What would you say to them in the91700:38:08.830 --> 00:38:11.570next 30 to 45 seconds to encourage them?91800:38:12.130 --> 00:38:14.090Let it go, let it go.91900:38:15.290 --> 00:38:17.570And, um, I'll offer something as well.92000:38:17.670 --> 00:38:19.050Go to, I feel like the theme from92100:38:19.050 --> 00:38:21.070frozen should be in the background while you're,92200:38:21.170 --> 00:38:23.090while you're doing that, Garry, go to my92300:38:23.090 --> 00:38:26.670website, www the learning moment.net and take92400:38:26.670 --> 00:38:27.830the dumb ass quiz.92500:38:28.340 --> 00:38:29.970And if you take the dumb ass quiz,92600:38:30.050 --> 00:38:32.010you'll get a score of dumb ass three92700:38:32.010 --> 00:38:34.350out of a hundred, and then I'll also92800:38:34.350 --> 00:38:36.950send you automatically a little workbook of what92900:38:36.950 --> 00:38:39.090are the things you can think about to93000:38:39.090 --> 00:38:43.210let go of, uh, that, that crown you93100:38:43.210 --> 00:38:46.270haven't to become a scholar of dumb ass93200:38:46.270 --> 00:38:48.430three or join the school of dumb ass93300:38:48.430 --> 00:38:49.670three that I have on LinkedIn.93400:38:49.730 --> 00:38:50.190So.93500:38:50.870 --> 00:38:53.010Well, we teach the power of dumb ass93600:38:53.010 --> 00:38:53.210three.93700:38:53.770 --> 00:38:55.530I feel like I've already part of that93800:38:55.530 --> 00:38:57.130school and haven't been taking the quiz yet,93900:38:57.510 --> 00:38:58.850Garry, so I'll sign up for it.94000:38:58.970 --> 00:39:01.730And Jim, thank you again for, uh, the,94100:39:01.790 --> 00:39:04.670uh, imperfect manifesto and providing that.94200:39:04.810 --> 00:39:06.490Garry, thank you for all the tools.94300:39:06.550 --> 00:39:08.670This conversation has been absolutely fantastic.94400:39:09.050 --> 00:39:11.030Garry Ridge, Jim Brown.94500:39:11.250 --> 00:39:13.790My name is Adam Durso and this has94600:39:13.790 --> 00:39:15.330been Faithly Podcast.94700:39:15.990 --> 00:39:16.890Thank you for joining us.94800:39:17.010 --> 00:39:19.370Follow us on all the social handles and94900:39:19.370 --> 00:39:20.610the description in the bio.95000:39:20.890 --> 00:39:22.870Have a great rest of your day and95100:39:22.870 --> 00:39:23.370lead well.